: You may be more used to not using Ghostblade, but that doesn't change the stats that showed Ghostblade was a LOT stronger. Ghostblade was what allowed Twitch to play aggressive around the 10-15 minute area and start snowballing. It enabled his assassination gameplay like Bork did in previous seasons. I see no reason why Riot can't give us both offensive and defensive use of invis. We had it before and it was perfectly balanced. Remember, shaco gets 6 seconds of non-fade time, full invisibility with a blink. And they're not changing that to a camouflage. 4-8 seconds of true invis with a fade time is fine. Enemies already get the shimmer effect, and red trinket still shows our position. Twitch's live stealth duration lasts 4 seconds at rank 1, and that's enough time to assassinate as long as you know how to use brushes. Saying 8 seconds is too little is absurd. Rank 1 or 2 invis and ghostblade have been all I've ever needed to 1v1 any enemy ADC if I hadn't fed them prior. > Evelynn has a movement speed buff, but Twitch has range. Assassinations of enemy ADCs require getting pretty close to them so they can't flash or dash away. Standing at 700 range they can just walk out. Especially since we've lost ghostblade.
> [{quoted}](name=CSDragon,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=fAEwn7uP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-11-04T15:20:37.653+0000) > > I see no reason why Riot can't give us both offensive and defensive use of invis. I would like to play Twitch before his Season 2 rework with 50 s stealth. But Riot nerfed it down to 8 s and 1.5/4.5 s fade time. > Twitch's live stealth duration lasts 4 seconds at rank 1, and that's enough time to assassinate as long as you know how to use brushes. Saying 8 seconds is too little is absurd. Rank 1 or 2 invis and ghostblade have been all I've ever needed to 1v1 any enemy ADC if I hadn't fed them prior. If Twitch has to use brushes he can be countered by wards. If you are stronger than an enemy Adc and he is alone, 8s are enough to kill him. But maybe he is not alone, so waiting in stealth near him until he is a little bit more alone is advantageous, but that not possible with a short stealth. Maybe you don't know where the enemys are, so using the stealth for scouting is advantageous, but you can't scout for long with a short stealth and it is very dangerous, because if the situation is bad and the stealth ends, Twitch gets killed. Maybe you want to wait for the enemys to line up for your ultimate or to waste their spells or to reposition yourself for your ultimate or to wait for your team to engage. That is also not possible with a short stealth. > Assassinations of enemy ADCs require getting pretty close to them so they can't flash or dash away. Standing at 700 range they can just walk out. Especially since we've lost ghostblade. I think the vision range is a bit less than his normal AA range (550), isn't it? You can walk around the enemys, so the enemys have to either run into your team or into you.
: Twitch is not satisfactory.
I don't know if it is too weak currently, but Camouflage is the correct stealth type for Twitch imo. The problem is that his current stealth isn't reliable for escaping nor for engaging. Riot will not give us both, so we have to decide. And the primary usage of his stealth should be offensively imo. Twitch's stealth has to be activated before he is in vision of a ward or minions if he want to assassinate someone. This means he has to walk a high distance for 8 seconds. If he is in the perfect position, there is always no time left anymore, what makes it very dangerous. He should have enough time to get out, if the situation is bad for an engage. And he should have more time to chase enemys in stealth. 8 s is terrible. 10-14 s is already a lot better. But it should be probably a bit longer at rank 5. Maybe 10-18 s or 10-22 s. A problem is that his stealth loses almost all of the defensive power. If he is unable to lane anymore, the vision radius should be reduced a bit, and the movement speed buff should be constantly 30%, even if he runs away. > A large part of this is removal of Ghostblade as an ADC item I like to play him with BF->Runaans->IE. It just scales better. The 2-item power spike is strong. > Camouflage is not a good fit for Twitch. It messes with everything he wants to do, and unlike other Camouflage users, he doesn't have a gap closer. Evelynn has a movement speed buff, but Twitch has range. > Twitch wants to do 3 things with his invis. .... 2) Walk right through the enemy team, get behind them and rip apart their backline. .... If the stealth is longer, he can just walk around the enemy team. It should be a bit longer than 14 s so that walking around big structures is a bit more promising. It is no problem for Evelynn to get to the backline. The stealth duration is just more important than the vision radius.
: A question about the new Duskblade of Draktharr
Probably yes, you can't see him during his alpha strike, he isnt even on the map.
: The Shaco changes are not healthy. They should not go through.
> [{quoted}](name=SlayerTayPBE,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=iOVWbu92,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-10-23T03:00:28.802+0000) >They changed the bonus AD scaling to total AD, like I've said before, to force AD playstyle. What? That doesn't make sense. AP Shaco has base AD too. > **These changes are not good. They restrict playstyles, they overall nerf his champion as a whole, they promote abusing a specific item set rather than having a variety of options, and kill his strengths. Riot said they wanted to tone down his early game, and they certainly have, but their solution to buffing his mid to late game is simply promoting AD/Crit because it scales well. This is not what Shaco players want. We don't want to be told that the validation for nerfing his best strengths is to build for late game and hope that we are not left behind. This is not a good fix until his VGU.** The changes look like a buff for AP Shaco and a nerf for AD Shaco: - His passive is only good for 1 AA within 3 seconds, not for constant Autoattacking. So it is good for AP Shaco, who maybe only wants to get one Lich bane proc of, instead of AD Shaco who constantly autoattacks. - The crit on his Q is now on his passive, and it is weaker, so the AD scaling was nerfed. - Q has additional flat damage with an 50% AP scaling now instead. - Q duration was nerfed in the early game, what nerfes jungle Shaco (AD most of the time) more than Lane Shaco (often AP). - The box duration have an additional AP scaling now. - If the clone is killed, additional boxes spawn with AP scalings.
: Too Many Ad+ magic resist items
> the closest thing league has to an ap assassin item is haunting guise Abyssal is not good anymore, but what about {{item:3089}} {{item:3100}} {{item:3146}} {{item:3152}} ? These are strong all in items. I agree that there are too many AD-MR items. The MR on these items should be lowered.
: Duskblade cooldown won't reset after becoming "unseen" if you proc it on neutral monsters
: [Assassins] - Mini Updates Discussion
Feedback on Twitch {{champion:29}} : Lets sum up the changes first: - Q stealth type changes to camoflage with detection radius like Evelynn - Q duration changes to 10-14 from 4-8 seconds - Q movement speed bonus lowered to 10% from 20% if running away, and increased to 30% from 20% if running towards enemys. - Q fading time is not extended anymore by taking damage. Its always something like maybe 1.25 seconds. - W applies 1-4 poison stacks over 3 seconds if the enemy stands still instead of applying 2 stacks instantly. - W slow increased to 40%-60%, but is only applied if the enemys remain in the area. This changes mean that it is more difficult for Twitch to escape, but easier to engage especially early in the game because of that 10 s camoflage. This means Jungle Twitch is buffed, Lane Twitch is nerfed. Escaping with stealth was one thing that made Twitch fun. I would consider a smaller stealth detection radius, so that it is still possible to escape from a little bit more situations with some good escape paths. With the current radius it is a little bit to easy to see him, what will maybe delete Lane Twitch entirely. On top of this the movement speed buff while escaping is lowered. This makes it not only more difficult to escape, it makes it more difficult to manage the range while waiting for an opportunity to engage too. It should be a constant movement speed. The W is a little bit better now for defense: If someone walks up to Twitch, he can place the W in between, so that the enemy gets slowed more and takes more poison stacks. But I doubt that this is enough defense for Twitch in Lane. The W applies now up to 4 poison stacks. This makes the poison limit of 6 extremely easy to reach. I would consider to increase the cap. I see another problem: There is no reason to level up something else than E first. 1 second of stealth and 5% attack speed is not enough if the duration is already 10 s. And 14 s in the late game is a little bit low compared to Rengar and Evelynn. Something like 20 s would make sense. An AP scaling on the stealth duration would also be an interesting idea. Maybe 1 second per 10 AP. So you could go for Rageblade if you want a bit more stealth duration. And leveling W feels like having no impact at all. What about increasing the poison stack limit with every point in W? Twitch poison would be more important in the late game, maybe the AD per Level would have to be lowered for this, but Twitchs poison should be strong in the late game. And another thing: There should be a way (using Q again) to cancel Twitch stealth like before the visual update, because the CD doesn't start before the stealth has ended. At the moment you can only use your W to cancel stealth if you know that you will not engage now, to let the CD happen faster.
: Duskblade of Draktharr change
> [{quoted}](name=Toushirou22,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=2Jabbhpy,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-01-27T21:06:10.984+0000) > > FINALLY- shouldn't this be melee only? it currently does not state it is, and i most certainly think it should be. It doesn't make sense to restrict it. Hydra is Meele only, because only Meeles attacks can swing in a circle. And Runaans is ranged only because only ranged champion can fire bolts. But this new item makes sense for both. I think a problem is, that the item passive effect has a high base damage but no AD/AP scaling. This makes it good champions, who don't build much offensive items. For example: Garen, Warwick, Renekton, Vi, Lee Sin, Rek'Sai, Jarvan IV, Leona. It should be more restricted to Assassins imo. Overall it is a bad item. Assassins are already toxic, and this makes them even more toxic, even if they get nerfed, because it emphasize their toxicness.
: Rengar jump bug
Its easy to fix, they need to make it work like Kassadin/Fiddlesticks jump. But its very funny.
: 180% mana regen is an odd and random number
Odd and random at the same time? That doesn't make sence. If it is odd it is likely exactly calculated.
: PBE is to find bugs. Not to evaluate balance. They want to see if game problems happen. They aren't wanting our advice on what to do with a champion/item. They are going to put out the item they have and see what happens balance wise. They only care about unintended bugs.
> [{quoted}](name=ChessPwn,realm=PBE,application-id=cMKtzQHY,discussion-id=HKbalrXd,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-11-12T18:09:12.532+0000) > > PBE is to find bugs. Well, I found a Bug with Runaans Hurricane and posted it in this forum before 5.22. Nothing happend. Now the bug is on the live servers.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=WidderPBE,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=HKOIluNZ,comment-id=00010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-10T18:05:15.346+0000) > > I consider build optimization to be my greatest strength tbh. > You may consider it your greatest strength..... But other people probably wouldn't. Those builds aren't that good. For what it's worth, I'm not trying to be mean, and you're even correct that you don't necessarily NEED to finish your jungle item. But if you're an AP jungler and you are going to go with a sheen upgrade.... You really need to go Runeglaive, if for nothing more than slot efficiency
I need extra slots for Talisman and Machete, but by the time I need these slots, I can sell these items, and get extra gold for it. These items are not necessary anymore late in the game. And in a Full Build I want to have Lich bane instead of Runeglaive anyway, since Lich bane has CDR too.
: Sorry.... But those builds are terrible. That's probably why you don't like the item, because you don't optimize builds very well. Even last season, when iceborne wasn't as good as this season, iceborne or triforce was always the correct decision on nasus even jungle nasus who should be getting a Cinderhulk. Likewise, jungle Malphite is CONSTANTLY bring hit by jungle monsters and is CONSTANTLY in melee range (for Cinderhulk's passive). These were ALWAYS the better builds for them. And if you're going AP Evelynn.... You don't build that way. You build a Runeglaive and a Rylai's as your core almost 100% of games and then either go AP or tank from there depending on how the game goes. Nashor's tooth is a complete waste of money on her because her Q practically works as an auto attack replacer, so you really don't need to give her magic damage on hit at such an expensive price... Especially since if you are building pure AP otherwise she's not actually going to stick around long enough to make use of more than a few AAs. I mean, I'm not disinclined to say that Runeglaive might be too expensive now, but that's not the same thing as what you are saying, that is better to go stalker's blade + lich bane on Evelynn... Which is just wrong
> [{quoted}](name=SonicTheHedgehog,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=HKOIluNZ,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-10T12:11:32.466+0000) > > Sorry.... But those builds are terrible. That's probably why you don't like the item, because you don't optimize builds very well. > > Even last season, when iceborne wasn't as good as this season, iceborne or triforce was always the correct decision on nasus even jungle nasus who should be getting a Cinderhulk. I consider build optimization to be my greatest strength tbh. Nasus is a very strong duelist with Runeglaive. The problem of AD-tank Nssus is that his E is weak. The Problem of AP-tank Nasus is that his Q is weak. Runeglaive is good for Q and E, so it is somewhat the ideal Nasus item. I only started jungling with Nasus because of Runeglaive. > Likewise, jungle Malphite is CONSTANTLY bring hit by jungle monsters and is CONSTANTLY in melee range (for Cinderhulk's passive). Malphite needs CDR and damage at some point imo. I don't think Runeglaive is ideal, but Cinderhulk doesn't make sense for me because it delays his CDR and damage items too much. But maybe I underestimate Full Tank Malphite, I don't play it. > And if you're going AP Evelynn.... You don't build that way. You build a Runeglaive and a Rylai's as your core almost 100% of games and then either go AP or tank from there depending on how the game goes. Nashor's tooth is a complete waste of money on her because her Q practically works as an auto attack replacer, so you really don't need to give her magic damage on hit at such an expensive price... Currently I buy Runeglaive, Ionian boots, Deathcap, Rylais and 2 more AP items on Evelynn. Rylais is great, but Rabadons just takes her damage to a whole new level so it has priority. But even more important than AP is CDR, because CDR works for Eves Q like Attack speed for an Adc, and 40% CDR increases her Q-DPS as much as 110% AS increases Caitlyns AA-DPS at Level 18. Currently I use 15% CDR from runes and masteries, 10% from Runeglaive and 15% from boots. But next season Ionian boots give only 10% CDR and CDR cap is increased to 45%. This means I need 10% additional CDR. That is the first reason for Nashors Tooth. But the on hit effect from Nashors tooth is good for Evelynn too, because E procs on-hit effects twice and gives 120% Attack speed. E has a 180% AP ratio with Lich bane and Nashors Tooth. Because of this and Q's AP ratio I will prefer Rabadons over Rylais again. The slow and the health are nice, but with Nashors+Lich+Rabadons Eve has higher one-shot potential, and the DPS is insane too. > I mean, I'm not disinclined to say that Runeglaive might be too expensive now, but that's not the same thing as what you are saying, that is better to go stalker's blade + lich bane on Evelynn... Which is just wrong Talisman+Machete+Fienish Codex+Sheen. This costs only 2550, gives 10% more CDR than Runeglaive, 15 less AP on the other hand, but has much better upgrades later. If Runeglaive isn't even a powerspike, what I calculated in my first post, but denies a later powerspike, it is just too weak. I don't buy Stalkers on Evelynn, I buy Trailblazer on every champion. Eve has enough damage and a long range slow, and it sucks to don't have smite for an objective after smiting a champion. Without Trailblazer jungling will be harder, but stalkers is still not appealing for me.
: See here's the thing with that: Neither Malphite nor nasus should be going runeglaive ANYWAY. They CAN go for more AP heavy builds, but going tank is usually way better for both of them, and nasus does considerably better as an AD tank than an AP tank. So really all that leaves is Evelynn. You are correct that AP eve is going to do more damage with a lich bane.... But AP eve does not want to waste money on a warrior enchant since that does nothing for her lich bane... Also runeglaive is generally jungle Evelyn's only mana item unless she grabs a frozen heart, so the mana restoration portion of it is really really useful on her. Yes her passive is helpful, but in an extended battle she chews through mana, so keeping it higher at all times is very helpful. Furthermore the slot efficiency of a runeglaive is just the icing on the cake and the main reason I'd never take lich bane over it since you kind of need a jungle item and something not AP+lich bane isn't going to be as good as something AP +Runeglaive
> [{quoted}](name=SonicTheHedgehog,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=HKOIluNZ,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-10T03:12:59.748+0000) > > See here's the thing with that: > Neither Malphite nor nasus should be going runeglaive ANYWAY. They CAN go for more AP heavy builds, but going tank is usually way better for both of them, and nasus does considerably better as an AD tank than an AP tank. Nasus should buy a sheen item. Runeglaive was the cheapest sheen item and had the jungling passives, so it was the best for Jungle Nasus. And the AP was good for his E and R too. I used to buy Runeglaive + Liandries and 3 tank items. Now I will still buy Sheen on Jungle Nasus (if i still play it), but I will buy a Gauntlet, Triforce or Lich bane later instead of Runeglaive. I will either buy no completed jungle item or Cinderhulk very late in the game. I think an AP build is good for jungle Malphite, because he doesn't need as much armor to survive a lane. In a lane I prefer a armor - magic penetration - cdr build. > So really all that leaves is Evelynn. > > You are correct that AP eve is going to do more damage with a lich bane.... But AP eve does not want to waste money on a warrior enchant since that does nothing for her lich bane... I think Warrior into Full AP will do around the same damage as Runeglaive into Full AP. But I will rather buy no completed jungle item at all. I need the machete and the talisman, but afterwards I will go for Nashors Tooth, Lich bane and Rabadons. Warrior into AD+crit+tank will maybe be good too, since crit-itemization is buffed heavily, but i'm not sure yet, it is not that good for one-shotting. First clear is super hard for Eve though (Begin of Season 5 was super easy in comparison), maybe it is better to play her in mid or top lane now. > Also runeglaive is generally jungle Evelyn's only mana item unless she grabs a frozen heart, so the mana restoration portion of it is really really useful on her. Yes her passive is helpful, but in an extended battle she chews through mana, so keeping it higher at all times is very helpful. I think the +250 Mana is more useful than the Mana restoration on Sheen against Jungle monsters, because Eves passives mana regeneration scales with Mana. I play Full AP Evelynn, so battles are not that extended, I kill, get killed or disengage. In the late game Mana is no problem.
: it's not so much that you CAN'T clear before it, but it really really helps clear super quickly so you can get right back to ganking after a fast clear
> [{quoted}](name=SonicTheHedgehog,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=HKOIluNZ,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2015-11-09T23:14:52.978+0000) > > it's not so much that you CAN'T clear before it, but it really really helps clear super quickly so you can get right back to ganking after a fast clear I bought Runeglaive recently on Evelynn, Nasus and Malphite. Evelynns clear is already very nice in the mid game, Lich bane will be more useful, because it is stronger against champions, Warrior will be better than Runeglaive on her too. Nasus has no problems with clearing at this point. Runeglaive even makes my loosing one stack at wraith camp. Malphite has the most and longest clearing problems of these three, but I don't think that I will buy this bad version of Runeglaive on him. Iceborn gauntlet, Nashors tooth or Morellonomicon will be better I think, but I have to test it.
: runeglaive also gives mana restoration, buffs the passives of the item AND gives an AoE proc to speed up clearing. I wish it were a LITTLE cheaper, but it's not bad
> [{quoted}](name=SonicTheHedgehog,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=HKOIluNZ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-11-09T22:40:45.440+0000) > > runeglaive also gives mana restoration, buffs the passives of the item AND gives an AoE proc to speed up clearing. I wish it were a LITTLE cheaper, but it's not bad But 2675 gold means that it is a little bit late for these effects. Clearing is a problem in the early game, but not really in the mid/late game. At least for the champions I play.
: Skill with other roles and champions does matter even when you're not playing those roles and champions. The more you understand how your teammates and opponents play, the better able you are to coordinate team plays and outplay your opponents. Win rate is a function of how well you can decide what play to make and how well you can perform that play. Experience with other roles and champions can definitely improve the former if not the latter. As for your second point, "but the same thing can happen in the enemy team. So there is really no regular effect", is equally applicable to the new system as to the old. Both teams are equally likely to encounter a situation where switching roles would be advantageous. Furthermore, you say that changing your mind in traditional champ select doesn't matter at all, but it does... it's just less obvious. People have their own experiences and preferences either way, it's just that the new system makes them more formally transparent and helps to prevent conflicts within teams. Being equally skilled at every champion isn't going to help you more than having 2 adc mains on your team when your opposing team had one main for each position is going to hurt you. By preventing that kind of situation, the new champ select reduces the random factor of matchmaking and makes progression more skill-based. Moreover, none of the problems you complain about in the new system don't already exist in the classic system. If you want to say it's wrong because of them, that's your opinion and you're entitled to it, but I remain unconvinced.
> [{quoted}](name=Anrita,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=3qWEj48G,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2015-11-09T12:28:58.318+0000) > > Skill with other roles and champions does matter even when you're not playing those roles and champions. The more you understand how your teammates and opponents play, the better able you are to coordinate team plays and outplay your opponents. Win rate is a function of how well you can decide what play to make and how well you can perform that play. Experience with other roles and champions can definitely improve the former if not the latter. That is right. But I don't think that someone gets better in his main role by playing other roles, than is main role is potentially better than is bad roles. Someone who has a 65% win rate in his main role and a 35% win rate in his bad roles for example, maybe will have only a 60% win rate in his main role if he has no experience in other roles, but that is still better than a 50% win rate which he gets if he plays his main role as much as his bad roles. If a one trick pony plays only his main role, he will gain elo imo. And if the matchmaking helps him this is unfair for versitale players. There is a advantage too: These one trick ponys will only have a 50% win rate because it is the only thing they play. That makes them less dangerous, what is nice, but it is still unfair elo-wise. > > As for your second point, "but the same thing can happen in the enemy team. So there is really no regular effect", is equally applicable to the new system as to the old. Both teams are equally likely to encounter a situation where switching roles would be advantageous. No. If my team has already encountered this situation, the other team will not have a 100% probability like my team to encounter this situation too. The probability is overall higher for versitaile players than for others. > By preventing that kind of situation, the new champ select reduces the random factor of matchmaking and makes progression more skill-based. That is nice. There are benefits, but disadvantages too. I don't see the necessarity of the change. LoL got the most played game in his current state. And now Riot changes everything. Why? Because they are bored by the game? It seems so. Overall the changes to the game are strange, complicated and counterintuitive.
Rioter Comments
: Your first and second points kind of counter each other. A player who gets experience with multiple roles will have an improved strategic sense of the game over a player who only focuses on one or two roles, whereas a player that focuses on only one or two roles will have more finely tuned mechanics for those roles. Seems to me that the two advantages balance each other out. On your third point, you're right that champion picks and bans can influence champion selection so that players would want to change roles, but the new matchmaking allows us to do this. Nothing about the new system prevents teammates from trading positions. Sure, you will still be labeled with the position you queued in as, but nothing forces you to play that position once the game starts. Teammates can simply agree to a trade in the lobby and there's no problem. As for your fourth point, it absolutely does. I remember that when the community asked Riot to build an improved matchmaking system to put an end to the raging in champ select over disputed roles, they were initially hesitant to do so for exactly this reason, but decided to make Teambuilder as a way to allow structured matchmaking while allowing experimentation with different team arrangements. Personally, I really like Teambuilder, but I'm guessing that Riot looked at the data and saw that the vast majority of players were just following the meta. Also, I think it's fair to say that most players who go into draft selection games without a prearranged team do so with the expectation that the other players they're matching up with will follow the meta to some extent. Does that suck? Yeah, kind of, especially when we've seen creative meta-breaking comps outplay traditional meta-following comps in high profile games. But, I think those kinds of new and diverse strategies are much more likely to be successful when they're carefully though out ahead of time, and in my opinion, to get everyone to understand and agree to that kind of unusual strategy generally requires more time.
> [{quoted}](name=Anrita,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=3qWEj48G,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-11-08T13:47:14.345+0000) > > Your first and second points kind of counter each other. A player who gets experience with multiple roles will have an improved strategic sense of the game over a player who only focuses on one or two roles, whereas a player that focuses on only one or two roles will have more finely tuned mechanics for those roles. Seems to me that the two advantages balance each other out. Experience in your bad roles is way less beneficial for your performence in your main role, than your main role can be potentially better than your bad roles. Someone with a 60% win rate in his main role and a 40% win rate in other roles, will climb massively, if he can play this role every time, until the win rate in his main role drops to 50% (and he is completely unable to play anything else). Maybe he would be a little bit better, if he would play other roles too. But if he would do that in ranked this positive effect would be completely whitewashed by his bad performances in his bad roles. What I say is, that it is boring to play everytime the same. But it is the best thing to gain elo. And what I say is that playing everything makes you a better player OVERALL, but this doesn't matter in a ranked system, where you never have to play 3 roles. > On your third point, you're right that champion picks and bans can influence champion selection so that players would want to change roles, but the new matchmaking allows us to do this. Nothing about the new system prevents teammates from trading positions. Sure, you will still be labeled with the position you queued in as, but nothing forces you to play that position once the game starts. Teammates can simply agree to a trade in the lobby and there's no problem. There is a problem. If I change the position with someone, it is likely that the other person is a little bit worse in his new position, because he wanted originally a different position. At the same time everyone in the enemy team can get his main position. So my team has a disadvantage in the average case. In the current system this is a little bit different: If I change my mind before I select a champion, it doesn't matter at all. My team members doesn't even notice it. there is no disadvantage for my team in the average. Of course sometimes someone else wants the position that I picked, but the same thing can happen in the enemy team. So there is really no regular effect. The new system will help somewhere and it will be disturbing in other places. But rules, which have positive and negative effects, should not be intruduced in general. When in doubt a natural state is better than a overregulated state. In the new champion selection, what can someone do, who doesn't want to play a against a specific champion in lane, which the enemy has picked? He can try to trade. If nobody wants to trade he can change his position nonetheless. And he can try to push someone into dodging. And he can dodge himself. And I wouldn't blame him for anything because the system is wrong.
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WidderPBE

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