: What happened to the option to abstain when voting for a champ to play?
just dont pick and you should be abstaining...
: One for All is coming to PBE
Thank gods for the vote update. People were basically ransoming games before and that ruined a lot of fun chances.
Rioter Comments
: Runes Reforged PBE Bugs & Feedback Thread
Overall my thoughts go to a need to add in a medium tank tree which is for bruisers who want tank early and rely on items late. All the resolve tree seems to be for tanks who build tank and want more tank. Meanwhile, bruisers and champs who need a little extra defense to get by don't get the options they need to go into lane with the survivability they need. My typical toplaner rune page used to be 20 armor 10 mr and 8 ad. I had plenty of survivability and could build normal offensive items during the game to become a threat. Now I start with zero defense when I go into a game unless im insanely naturally tanky. For an update that was supposed to let us choose how we play more it seems to be doing the opposite. I should be able to give teemo early tankiness. Even if you grab resolve on someone like Teemo they don't become tanky, they just have the potential to late game, and late game Teemo wants to have damage and threats. Teemo just can use a little extra defense early because of aggressive tops and a lack of hard cc. As well the ult CD reduces Rune (ultimate hat) needs to either work with charge cds on ults (Ie Teemo and Akali) OR indicate it will not work on that champion.
: not really had a{{champion:420}} with{{item:3065}} {{item:3812}} {{item:3025}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3158}} {{item:3053}} she had 4k hp 420 ad 110 armor 100 mr and it was just plain busted she can 2-3 shot almost ever champ 4-5 for tanks heals faster then you can hurt her. and its all do to how powerful the off runes are there just insane with how hard they scale you can go 0 tank runes with a tank and end up as a tank assassin( wiitch is not ok)
I'm talking about non-tanks who need some base defense and tanks who literally just sit there. You're showing off illaoir with 5 items with offensive aspects to them (only one that isnt is visage). You're playing super aggressive. You can't get by just being tanky and ignoring the enemy. You've literally provided the opposite example.
: New tank stuff is insanly more powerfull then the old ones. Gettin permanent Armor, Magic resist flat and % is so much better then base stats. Mages have so much more ways to put their damage out right now. Just find the right runes that fit your playstyle. Dont build runes on how your vision was.
But its not the tanks having issues its the in between guys who need a little extra survival because they're melee bruisers and skrimishers. Instead of having a chance to go into sustained fights they get nuked by people using the new damage options.
: They got rid of magic pen and mr runes... It basically balances out. You cant just give people a bunch of armor and mr as base since the common things people took to counter those things are gone. You would just make everyone tankier than before the rune rework.
They may have removed the pen, but they added way more offense at the start in the runes. Its way more on the offensive side already.
: Its not a mistake. Not only got the defensive runes removed, all runes got removed, including offensive runes. Squishys are insanly squishy cause did u ever saw an mage counter an sword with his robe? Mages are squishy and this is good so. If you want Magic resist, use the correct Rune for it, if you want armor their is also to correct rune for it, you need damage? read the runes :D The new system needs a few weeks until player fully understand it, and you will see near no difference to the old. (Yeah ok there are a few new cheap tricks to make little cracks to the balance, but it is overall fairly balanced)
The new runes are heavily on the offensive side as well as removing the usual defense players were used to have. Its a 1 2 punch. if you already played with a focus on high agression and mobility you move over just fine, but if you played with even a hint of tank and survival on champs who aren't building the resolve page you're in trouble in the new system.
: Many AP Mages are boned with the Rune update
Why do you need more magic pen when no one has starting rune armor/mr anymore. IF you build a single pen item you basically are hitting near true dmg.
: if that were to happen, you need to give base magic pen/lethality as well, which nobody currently has.
Pen is insanely more powerful right now because there is no base resistance. They removed most of the base defense and added a ton of offense unless you focus on being pure tank where you break about even. If you rush lethality right now you basically get true damage because everyone has so little defense.
: To be fair the builds in the tank path are strong as all hell, you can build almost any farming tank to nigh invincibility at 20-30 minutes.
Im not talking about building out farm tanks. Im talking about having a little extra defense right off the bat to make laning easier.
Rioter Comments
: “Invasion” PvE game mode falling from the stars to PBE soon for testing.
Well I was excited, but if its star guardians only I'm not gonna touch it. I like 1 champ who has a star guardian skin, hate the skin for her, hate the skin line in general, and don't want to play the same champ over and over. I like PVE doom bots 2 was amazing. I'm fine with specific roster types. Blood moon has a solid variety of champs with the only focus being "does a lot of damage fast" (I still played lee as a off tank there to mess with people :D). This just seems... like a promotion for the skins more than anything else. Which it can be a promotion, but it feels like that was the only point.
: U forgot about {{champion:81}} <3
At least you can be against a distinctly bad ez. He still has to use skillshots.
: Is there a reason flat armor penetration is being removed from champion's kits?
Rammus was changed for consistancy. He was half as half ap and it left him wanting so they made him all magic damage. He didnt need armor pen after that.
: if you dont like it dont play it im sure there are plenty of players who like urf as it is now {{sticker:slayer-jinx-unamused}}
That solves nothing. To replace a gamemode and not have any concessions to make up to the people losing is nonsense.
: An issue about two items in URF
I mean zzrot was removed so I see no reason edge of night can't be.
: Or we can simply petition for her to be the chosen disabled champion. Even with the healing embargo, her heal spamming is simply too strong for it.
they should keep the heal embargo all game. once you hit late most champs are beyond broken and get EVEN more from the embargo going away.
: Because everyone would instalock all the op picks, thus playing the same game over and over again.
I play plenty of underpicked but still enjoyable champs. The randomness means I'm left with champs I don't enjoy.
: > What's changed? Since the last time we ran ARURF the following champs have undergone some sort of decent surgery or are new! > Camille Warwick Assassins patch Talon Katarina LeBlanc Rengar And Ivern ? You forgot the nice tree :0
: The Ghost nerf is not the way to go about it
Essentially fix it the same way you fix all the other move speed items. Melee get more than ranged.
: Shaco Ruined?
The changes have made hybrid shaco fantastic. I think it's killed crit builds though. Really the way shaco works now is far more about manipulation and set up without it being 100 to 0 box stacks. New shaco needs you to be a utility to the team in the early game. You go pick up people trying to back, you scare lanes and run away, you counter jungle with boxes providing cover or clear. Once you hit mid to late if you are doing well and have 20 to 30% and a gunblade you should be fine to go kill squishy targets. You will not burst as fast as other assassins but you have more CC, mobility, and mitigation than them. You can burst You q in land the backstab proc/hit with trinity then gunblade and w to kill. If you haven't killed the box you placed just before you back stabbed will have triggered and give you time to basic again possibly with a trinity proc. Finally if they are still alive you ult to dodge their response and with fakco you deal all the dmg you need. Fakco can also be used just before you start that combo if you don't need to dodge the enemy's response. Shaco is fine. He's just not PURE AD or PURE AP anymore. He is a hybrid champ and a damn good one.
: Plants Don't Provide Real Decisionmaking
I think the point was to mitigate decision making. They specifically wanted to cut to down to immediate choices.
: Opinion on Plants
gimmick is an apt description.
: People say Kassadin's fine but... idk. I personally don't find him fun to play as, especially not early game.
He's vaguely fun late game, but he doesn't do anything. He has no real damage no real power he's literally just mobile.
: [Assassins] - Mini Updates Discussion
Am I the only person who likes shaco now? I've been stomping repeatedly with him.
: > [{quoted}](name=TSK Horseman,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=AZZhU1PU,comment-id=0062,timestamp=2016-10-25T14:25:27.337+0000) > > Hello everyone, > > So i leave my Talon feedback here as well. The first impression is pretty cool. I like that Riot tried to implenet something new like his E. > > **No Jungler Items recommended - **The first thing I realized quickly after the start. I played him in Jungle, so I was going to buy the Jungler item, but it was not there under the recommended items. As far as I remember ther ould be an other list of Items when you have smite with you. > > **His passive is barley visible - **after ganking the first lane I realized that I nearly couldnt see his passive stacks. Maybe this is different on other skins. I played with SSW skin. In my opinion it should be a little bit more visible. > > **Timer on Walls - **The other part I realized while ganking was, that it is really tricky to remember, which wall i can use again in some seconds. As many chmpions has a timer on their stuff (like Zilean on his bomb) I suggest to implement something that you can see how long it might go until you can jump over it again. Something like the inhibitor, but I&#x27;d do it with colors. > > **CD on E - **is to short in my opinion. There is no diffference in having it on lvl 1 or on lvl 3. So the use of skill points has no value. In addition i agree with many players who said, that there is a lack of possibilities on Talon during teamfight and lategame. So I was thinking of why don&#x27;t you set a higher CD and make it also a dash-roll as well, when he is not near to a wall. > > **Line is not straight -** There are many walls on which you can jump over two parts (Here I am talking especially about the walls which are colse to the enemy base). When you jump over it the wall gets red. This line is okay (a little bit ugly when it ends in the middle but okay). The problem now is now whenyou jump over the second part, this one also gets red. well - the lines does not really fit everywhere. I saw it especially on the wall between the Wolfcamp and the enemy base. There is a part of where the lines meet, which is pretty ugly because there is a bigger part red. I tried to take a screenshot for you but League didnt save it with f12. I guess something went wrong there. Thats because talon is a mid lanner and not a jungler, we dont need more draven junglers, thank you.
The thing is he is SUPER effective as a jungler possibly more than a laner.
: **No. You just have to stop playing Shaco brainless, like E then Q someone, and expect to one-shot.** Get max cdr, a proper combo now is: Use Q then R while invisible, (optional before casting R, place a box while stealth on a way enemy is going to run), get backstab from Shaco and Clone, use E, use 2 autos, use E again. If its a squishy target, he probably dies, if not, you have Q again to finish him off or escape. They key to play new Shaco is constantly using backstab including the Clone, get CDR for the 6,6s+ Q cooldown, get put a box when they don't expect. E does massive damage after your burst from Q and backstab. Also, if you chase someone, you can start a fight from E to slow someone, then Q and and the rest, and use E at the end again, because its around 4,5s with max cdr. **TL;DR: You have to change playstyle, understand that you need max CDR and AD, proc passive properly, Q is main damage and E is a finisher.**
That's not what I said. I'm just saying the ranks of E basically add nothing. Its plus 75 dmg at max level right? I never said I expected it to nuke and kill anymore I glad it doesn't. I hated shaco being a targeted 800 dmg for nothing.
: No skill champs
Rengar press R jump and deal 900 dmg before you land. Don't even start with talon. you can use normal wards and suddenly he can't catch you off guard. From there its just playing up his melee weakness and the fact that if he uses his w and misses his combo is down for more than long enough to obliterate him. On top of it talon super weak to any and all cc even slows will stop him in his tracks. He's only doing as well as he is because its typically 4 assassins per game right now. As soon as you see a normal match with tanks and fighters he drops to mediocrity.
: After ANOTHER few games, have to say, E is still good, just you gotta get 40% cdr, Q, E, auto twice, use E again when someone is 1/3 or 1/4 HP, and someone is going to be dead for sure. E isn't maybe the best early, but Shaco is much better late game than before he was. http://i.imgur.com/G5OwdHj.png
It also has become very clear that you shouldn't level E until the end. There is basically no use to its level ups.
His old E wasn't poke it was a straight up nuke (at least for ap). Something needed to be done that Shaco wasn't just using E then leaving until it was off cooldown. As for everything else I largely agree he has some really bad late game problems still, and has lost his early supremacy. I do think they very much wanted him to be hybrid all the time now with these changes which depending on what you play is really weird. I for one always did hybrid so I've adapated nicely to it I suppose.
: > [{quoted}](name=TheAceInShades,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=AZZhU1PU,comment-id=0057,timestamp=2016-10-23T01:37:04.421+0000) > > Finally got a match against a normalish team (aka not 5 assassins), and WOW talon is abysmal (in lane). Any cc will shut him down and he has nothing to use against it. He might be able to q to an enemy out of the way, but at that point he&#x27;s condemned himself worse. His ult is the only other option and that only makes him feel worse. Other champs can just hit a basic spell and be scott free, but talon has to burn ult for a dumb luck chance to out run the enemy. His E is rarely an option in lane, and when it is usable in jungle most champs will kill him before he makes the whole jump (it is way too slow especially at the start and end) It would be fine if he could use it away from the wall but only over them, but with the current requirements he is going no where. I&#x27;d recommend letting him E along the outside walls for a little more mobility in bot and top. > > Next issue is actually rengar, but thats for another thread I suppose. Preseason is preseason rengar obliterates talon all day long. Please look at rengar bursting too hard. > > Third I feel like the basic attack to trigger his passive is super clunky. Talon is not fast with basics and his Q no longer is a reset (though I MUCH prefer this). Talon just doesn&#x27;t basic attack faster than most people will escape. All you have is a weak slow and a short dash to target how am i supposed to guarantee that basic attack? > > The final issue is that talon doesn&#x27;t really have a good reason to exist among other assassins atm. There is nothing that puts him equal or above them. He does all the same things but worse right now. Yes he can burst squishies, but not in anyway that makes him a pick over the other options around. > > I enjoy the concepts here, but he isn&#x27;t useful like the other picks. Heck I think Shaco meets a closer fantasy to how I thought Talon would play. Hyper mobile run in stab and combo run away go screw with someone else. Talon feels like he sits there and tries to land his one combo and probably dies in the process because his basic attack didn&#x27;t go off. I already told, talon will be unviable on competitive mode, most talon competitive players talking plat up will start to leave or to play other similar champs like wu for exemple. Right now the talon i see, is the talon where you go whit freinds and you troll them so hard that some rage quit.
He is fun overall. Just massively flawed for real play. I certainly know he won't be used by me on serious terms ATM. It makes me really sad as having an assassin in my main roster would be really nice. I liked talon way back when he came out, but he dropped into a play style I wasn't really enjoying.
: I know, but despite his passive ending up as a nerf or buff, the fact that he is losing flexibility bothers me and it will bother others as well. It's narrowing his strengths for viability.
20% dmg just for facing away wasn't a healthy system. Not only do people turn on a dime, but it made his nuke even harder when it didn't need to be and wasn't deserved. Yes this makes you basic more, but you can still be ap with it. I'd recommend gunblade because it is just plain good anyway, but even as pure ap you have enough burst potential that you won't need it.
: The Shaco changes are not healthy. They should not go through.
I actually like his passive, his q is not nearly as bad as you make it out (there is more than enough time even early. it's a freaking flash ffs), the boxes do disappoint slightly, but it teaches people to string them out into more elaborate traps. I agree largely on his E though. it feels very weak and unfufiling. Before it was this huge ap nuke, but now its kind of just an annoyance to help him poke or run faster. I'd swear its just for procing thunderlords. The boxes on ult need major work. Overall you act like Shaco was never leant towards being ad for half the skill and ap for the other half. He's always been in this weird place, and with current items he can do well.
: [Assassins] Talon feedback thread
Finally got a match against a normalish team (aka not 5 assassins), and WOW talon is abysmal (in lane). Any cc will shut him down and he has nothing to use against it. He might be able to q to an enemy out of the way, but at that point he's condemned himself worse. His ult is the only other option and that only makes him feel worse. Other champs can just hit a basic spell and be scott free, but talon has to burn ult for a dumb luck chance to out run the enemy. His E is rarely an option in lane, and when it is usable in jungle most champs will kill him before he makes the whole jump (it is way too slow especially at the start and end) It would be fine if he could use it away from the wall but only over them, but with the current requirements he is going no where. I'd recommend letting him E along the outside walls for a little more mobility in bot and top. Next issue is actually rengar, but thats for another thread I suppose. Preseason is preseason rengar obliterates talon all day long. Please look at rengar bursting too hard. Third I feel like the basic attack to trigger his passive is super clunky. Talon is not fast with basics and his Q no longer is a reset (though I MUCH prefer this). Talon just doesn't basic attack faster than most people will escape. All you have is a weak slow and a short dash to target how am i supposed to guarantee that basic attack? The final issue is that talon doesn't really have a good reason to exist among other assassins atm. There is nothing that puts him equal or above them. He does all the same things but worse right now. Yes he can burst squishies, but not in anyway that makes him a pick over the other options around. I enjoy the concepts here, but he isn't useful like the other picks. Heck I think Shaco meets a closer fantasy to how I thought Talon would play. Hyper mobile run in stab and combo run away go screw with someone else. Talon feels like he sits there and tries to land his one combo and probably dies in the process because his basic attack didn't go off.
: The jungle mob's change are Ok, but i feel like plants are really useles and not necessary. The old smite ssystem is way better.
I actually love the new smite it makes other champs more viable as there is an on demand heal. The planets don't feel really useful, but old smite was a pain and more there because we had to do something with smite.
: I noticed that sometimes it was faster to NOT cross certain walls. It kinda forces Talon to build as much movement speed as possible to make the animation take a reasonable amount of time.
I never do, so that could be why it feels trash to me. I rush cdr and a hydra and I fill in the last item with whatever I need for that game. He needs that CDR way more than move speed.
: There is only one thing i ask you to change. Please make Q act like an auto attack enhancer like it previously was. The targeting system we have for it right now honestly feels really bad and actually makes it feel a little slow. I don't see why it cannot be an ability you activate to give your next auto attack a buff that acts like it does now. Not only would this give you another lever for balance on the ability but allow it to feel much more smooth to use.
no. Talon's biggest flaw was that old attack enhancer Q being cut off. The Q being a target gives far more control and utility to it. As well it lets him have the dash on it at the same time as the crit without any confusion on when it will be which. If you think this is slow then you just can't quick cast well enough.
: [Assassins] Talon feedback thread
I love his E, but it doesn't feel like its for roaming at all. It's a weak to ok escape and sometimes a good ganking tool, but not for roaming. I use it once when I jump into lane and that's it. If I got bonus movespeed or something after I jump then I'd use it because honestly I feel MUCH slower when I am doing the jump.
: Vision changes and Teemo
How about something like it stalls the explosion. So if you fudge up while disabling them you won't be punished horribly for misclicking. At the same time it lets him use shrooms much more actively.
: Smite Recharge Cooldown is too long
I dunno with how powerful smite is now as the spell I think that 80 or 70 would be fine. 40 would basically let you smite every other champ for that huge heal.
: Healing on URF
I think the debuff should remain at fifty the entire game. Same for shields.
: Rip (ar)urf for me
You either stomp and don't feel like you earned it or are slaughtered because of dumb luck.
: Yeah I really didn't like the idea of AR Urf when people were talking about "balancing urf" earlier in the year. I liked the older version of URF mainly because you got to select who you wanted to play, even if you were against an op team comp well, at least you were still able to play who you wanted. Yeah I always feel like I'm playing against/with the same champs at times which gets really annoying. Also with old urf it was usually OP Team vs. OP Team now the matches are skewed depending on the champs you receive. As for your ideas... I agree with seeing the opposing team's champs. But only after champ select is done. So like after all the champs get locked in, there'll be a 30-60 second window to change runes/masteries while knowing what the enemy is playing but, without the ability to counter pick (hopefully that made sense) Kinda indifferent with increasing the number of re-rolls, not sure how different it would be with more re-rolls. Like someone could get really mad after wasting all 3 rerolls and not get a champ they want I guess @~@ Not sure about the randomizing section lol... But, if the system is only randomizing the champs each player owns, I definitely think it should go through all the champs and not just the champs you have. Not much of a problem in PBE but, once it reaches live people could theoretically cherry-pick which champs they want by only buying certain champs. Yes I agree with this lol... Games go waaay too fast so surrender should be around 15 minutes.
Being able to pick someone who isn't op but knowing its a champ you love may just be better than winning. When I can go braum in urf and have fun just off being a jerk to ezreals who are trying to spam ult then I consider it a win.
: Braum's got nothing going for Him.
They should tool around with some of the passives and item cooldowns for urf to see if they can make more champs viable.
: You are missing the point. The isnt if we are comfortable with random champions, i basically play ARAM once a day and a i love it. But i hate this random URF, not because i cant chose my comfortable champion, but because this doesnt work. What makes ARAM great, isnt just the random champions, is the one lane map. You have a five x five all the time. You cant go back to base to heal or shop, you have to fight, period. In this random URF, we have three lanes and huge jungle. Everybody is walking around to get as many kill as possible, and if you get a weak champion, the enemy will hunt the entire game, and you dont have a team around, like in ARAM. There is no teamplay on URF, never did, it is just about being fun doing crazy thingd. And it is not fun when you cant leave the nexus, because twitch is hunting you like crazy, and you team is all over the map, getting kills. URF is free for all, and you added random champions in that mix. It doesnt work.
I'm fine with being Nami. I'm not fine with that Eve that can roam like sonic the hedgehog and still dish out more damage than 3 people on my team together. I enjoy being new people and seeing how they work. I never knew renekton became such a monster late in urf.
: All Random URF for the RGM queue now live for testing on the PBE
Yeah random has only made it easier to tell who wins. When everyone picked broken champs yes you fought a lot of the same guys, but at least it was down to skill then because everyone was broken as all heck. I could fight eve with my awesome Renekton plays, but now I get handed Nami and am expected to still face that eve. It stops being fun right there because instead of it being all broken its a stomp. There are too many champions that you only need one moderate good user of to win for random to work.
: ARURF Balancing Idea & Feedback
A way to make it so there can only be 1 BROKEN champ per team could be interesting.
: [Gameplay] Discussion regarding AR URF Concerns/Suggestions inside.
I still think the most broken champs can be toned down with something simple (maybe 5% less cdr or something). But ten bans still seems like the best way to handle the whole thing.
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TheAceInShades

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