Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: I do not think that it is supposed to be the way it is now. With this early back the jungler is weaker than the support and the buffs aren't long enough to carry over that so you have to choose one buff which runs out before you have any chance to gank because u were too low. Also it is hard to jungle with a 60 second smite in the early game since you won't have it up for the buff if u used it at the first camp which is crap. Back in season 1 camps spawned at 1:40 which gave the lanes an unfair advantage etc. but it put the jungler in a not too thight spot with the buffs spawning at 1:55 or 1:50(do not remember correectly) though they also had to go b. Not the camps spawn at 1:55 and the buffs at 2:30 and nobody can help you with something maybe with the starting camp you can get help but thats it. Also we have the same problem with golems: If the bot lane is strong enough they can take them on blue side(for example leona with 3 pots can make this) which leads to an unfair advantage of exp and gold again. If they wanna make it so that the buffs cannot be taken early(which leads to less invades) they can make wolves and wraits spawn first at 1:50 then the buff at 2:05 to make it impossible for lanes to profit
The buffs were changed completely anyways. Early slow from red is non existent now, its more for sustain than for ganking. Take the Utility tree if you want a faster smite. If you get a hard leash, you can smite first camp just fine and it wont slow down taking your buff. All the buffs give on smite is mana/HP while the other camps give actual buffs to increase clear time. There is absolutely no issue with this current jungle if you use the proper runes and masteries. Ive probably tested 100+ times now with at least 2 dozen different champions and managed to clear the entire jungle and be level 6+ by 6 minutes with everyone. Lanes cant take golems or Gromp with the amount of HP they have and damage they deal for the marginal HP/XP you get from it. Gromp deals close to 90 per ranged auto at level 1, while the golems do close to 70 and 20 respectively with massive HP pools. you end up missing at least 1/2 - 2/3rds of your wave if you do the jungle camp which actually puts you farther behind. Riot wants the early back to make you choose how you're playing your jungle role ASAP. they want you to pick your enchantment and use it instead of ganking&farming for 3+ minutes while you have doublebuffs and then buying generic jungle item X while still doing it all.
: Did you play season 3? That was when sustain was too high for junglers, the current set up in season has been the most balance unless you get to high levels when it goes to that small pool of champs, lee elise kha j4 etc. The current changes on the pbe do nothing for what they need to address which is getting more junglers to the high competitive level.
The changes do everything to address it. Early gankers like Lee Sin, Elise, Kha all have to decide between a level 3 small camps clear, or small camp+buff before backing. Lee Sin can no longer go buff, camp, buff, and start ganking with 2-3 Pots up and 80% HP.
: By the way, I'm glad you can now smite Teemo :)
I honestly don't think its too much. All the changes boil down to right now are stronger jungles, streamlined items from a machete instead of madreds, stone, quillcoat. Regen is much easier to quickly do math on, and the tower changes require a larger player base to test.
: HI i played jungle with the new changes and i hate it here why: Nobody can go through the jungle without more than 2 pots apart from fiddle so the hunter machete is a crappy lvl 1 start -> cloth and back lvl 3 latest The smite boni doesn't work with quicksmite Spawn time of buffs is crap since you have to make 2 camps before them and then you are too low and no lane will help you. Spawn time of camps are no longer so that you can go through the jungle and then repeat which forces you to gank at lvl 5( if you backed lvl 3) which is not good for a lot of junglers Edit: in the late game baron buff seems extremely overwhelming to me. Teams with the ability to splitpush get almost unkillable melee minions to tank the tower and a cannon minion with extremely huge dmg and range so it is almost impossible to def 1 v 1 even with a good waveclearer(just my opinion didn't see it in the game) TLDR: Early game jungling seems like season 1 but the jungler got nerfed, buff spawns too late and camps have too long cooldown for a smooth jungle experience
The jungle change is supposed to work that way. They want you to do an early back to get the modified smite. Baronbuff is exactly what it should be now. The whole issue with trying to punch into the enemy base lategame is that you have xerath, lucian, corki etc who can all wave clear entire creepwaves with one ability leaving you to need the baron regen in order to break into the base. The removal of the regen from baron buff means that if you catch their team, they wont be pushing until they go b, they cant just stand near your base healing to full.
: No offense but you should read what I wrote again. To be clear all the jungle items give mana regen per sec while in combat but not nearly the same as the Spirit of the Elder Lizard because SotEL gives you back mana based on the your damage dealt. That is the reason why casters like Kha'Zix or Wukong was able to come out of the jungle with near full mana. With these changes you can only cast 1 spell at most per camp and with the increased difficulty of the camps, this is unacceptable for these junglers. Attack speed junglers like Warwick, Aatrox, and Jax are much more viable atm because they scale well with attack speed and they all have built-in on hit effects.
You aren't meant to be sustaining forever if you arent a sustain based jungle who doesnt want to just AFK farm. the entire issue with the current jungle on live is that the amount of sustain is too high. Jax onhit isnt until level 6, aatrox is much like Yi and WW in the fact they're built to jungle.
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