: > An example of a stale strategy is the laning phase, where generally you see the 1-1-2 lane scenario (recent lane-swaps in higher levels of play could be the beginning of a greater change in how the game is played). We do not want to promote alternative laning strategies. The laning phase is considered sacred for the most part. It you take a look at most alternative early game strategies (like 1-3-1 or double jungle, et al) - they involve basically either suppressing or overwhelming character pick and ability. It's about not giving the opponent a fair fight or a chance to show their skills in small fights. 1-3-1 is kind of the classic example of this, where the net result is that very very little skill is required to execute and only a small niche pool can ever fight it meaning that this lane strategy is a team trying to non-interactively win the game by not allowing the opponent to act. Most early game strategies of this type are only tactically rich in the fact that one formation overwhelms another - but the actual playing out of these formations are often fairly rote and predictable. Allowing multiple lane strategies like this - at first, looks like it allows a wider variety of player expression - but ultimately, when it comes to playing the game the amount of skill expression in the actual situation itself is ridiculously small.
Like the COMPLETE lack of skill it takes to play ryze, annie, tristana, kayle (and other point and click champs that are always strong in this game) that overwhelm EVERY skillshot based champ? This game was not and never will be about skill since all your hypercarries are point and click (0 skill) champs. If this game was about skill then point and click champs should never be able to become absurd hypercarries and in mind comes shitstana. A champ that has a gap closer with SLOW and a knock (care to remove that knock already, im suggesting this since you ppl suck @ your own game and have no idea how to nerf toxic champs... removed LB silence and took you 4 months to remove Talon's or what champs not to buff: point and click unkilalble endless cc tanks like MaoStar who are NEVER fun to play against and in their current state should not be viable picks) so that if she's ahead she'll kill everyone and no one can catch her (only way to deal with her is a solid team comp , STARTING with banning or picking thresh, and you ppl @ Riot keep LIEING, yes LIEING, about how a champ shoudnt be overwhelming to the point that the only way to stop it is a team comp). You talk about skill while a zoning champ like Orianna has a shield that gives her armor and mr so that if she fails to zone people she doesnt get punished... Apparently you have no idea what zoning champions are in videogames and what their weaknesses are. You just invent words and feel like you're gonna get down in history for coming up with MOBA or minonmancer. An artists who produces more than he studies is nothing but an amateur. Before you reinvent what zoning champs or tanks (coz your tanks are dps unkillable machines with %hp nukes not tanks) are in videogames how about yout take a break and PLAY some other games (i doubt you even play oyours if you find it fun to play against tristana alistar maokai and other such). You talked about the Bruisers project and how they are an issue (idk any bruiser with relevant skillshots) and a month ago you released Gnar (not to talk about endlessss free damage on nida's new kit because at level 3 the damage is absurd. she can 100-0 anyone with a single spell rotation that uses like 50 or no mana). Not sure if you people are like drunken flies (buzzing around with no target and doing w/e pops into your mind then another one of you pops around preaching about how unhealthy gameplay wise is what one of you just did and how it will never happen again) or worse (simple/limited and unable to think and come to the conclusion that OMG nida gnar are bruisers and we're not allowed to make those anymore).
: Team Builder (Updated 4/28)
Took me 30sec to queue up for **the most demanded role** (2min30sec estimated wait time) but after 9min it still didn't find me a team and when i cancelled to join another queue a few seconds later, that role was not even demanded anymore. I think the real time role/position demand one is bugged or the sample pool is simply insufficient or... the most demanded role got filled in the 30sec it took me to select a champ and queue up for a team (highly doubt it). I'm stuck in **"Prepare yourselves! The battle is about to begin..."** for 23min and can't press the pretty little red X to cancel the queue because **"This action is not currently available because matchmaking is in progress"**.
: Yeah, I agree we may have pushed too far towards making dealing damage such an important way to compete in the jungle. Too much of a reaction from the tank jungler meta in seasons past. This seems to point out that Spirit Stone may just be a flawed item, at least in isolation as the only real jungler item. It basically only favors champions that can deal tons of damage since they get the most mileage out of the sustain. I will say it's important that any changes we do don't just bring back the days of tanks chain-ganking and camping lanes repeatedly for the first 10 minutes of the game. There needs to be a balance here, and personally I feel that we need to tackle this from 2 angles: 1) How do tank junglers compete with damage junglers in early game clears? 2) What unique things can each tank jungler bring into a team composition later in the game? I can talk to Solcrushed about this or maybe get him to come chat about our plans for the jungle as he's been the primary driver of it.
1) Tanks clear slower early but as they level their main jungling ability, their innate tankiness soaks some of the damage they take from camps as the camps respawn stronger. DPS junglers who can't afford to get early lifesteal have no sustain in the jungle as they level their main ability so they aren't viable without the stone. Fix tanks early clear (lvl 1-5) and keep the stone as it is. Tweak around that is my suggestion, current jungle creeps spawning at a level based on the players level is fine. 2) They all have innate damage (amumu sej voli) and insane CC (naut, zac) but a tank jungler also means more top lane variety, mainly DPS champs. There are top lane champs that are still strong (Kennen, Rumble, Akali, Aatrox) but they're almost never picked although they didn't get touched (nerfed), they didn't lose any raw power, their power is relative to the meta forced by DPS only junglers. *Jungle too easy or tanks damage/sustain buffed* **->** *tanks chaingank.* (Naut didn't really need the recent buff). If the tanks *Stone removed* **->** *no DPS junglers.* **Rework the Tough Skin Mastery so it will speed up healing from pots when attacked by jungle creeps in the first 5 min of the game (or until level 3)**, will help tanks with the lvl 3 clear. This way, after the first clear they can gank once or twice then they'll have to work as before: rely on their native tankiness to farm (not on the jungle being easy to clear) and heal (not just pop up faster healing pots and chain gank). As a fan o early game DPS, i always struggled with sustain back in s3 in the rare cases i picked a DPS jungler (when i had a Lissandra/Ryze who could lock target down so i can dps) so i looked forward towards the stone changes. The stone is ok imo (allows dps junglers to compete with tank ones after the 1st recall), it's just the first 3 levels that tank junglers have real issues now and imo it has to do with the **slow regen from the pots (always low after clearing and until the pots heal)** leaving them vulnerable to counterjungle or impossible to countergank. A tank jugnler's counterganks usually consist of disrupting the enemies and locking them down with his CC, especially if they dive (lee/elise/vi issues).
: [4.5] The Changes to the Lee Sin Changes
You're not gonna answer this post because it's the elephant in the room. First of all i'm happy with the change, the most frustrating thing when playing against jungle lee is his obscene W mobility, even if you commit everything he can freaking escape using it 2 times on wards/champs plus a flash to disengage. As a lane lee player i'm fine with the W change. As for Elise, stun nerf is fine, max dmg vs monsters nerf is fine, Q damage nerf is horrible, fucks top Elise even more. Make spiderlings take more damage from jungle creeps so she won't have such a strong lvl 1-3 jungle sustain and clear. She will be low on hp during/after clearing, so whe will be vulnerable to counterjungling. Can you assume your mistakes for once? You screwed the jungle and destroyed lots of viable junglers. YOU did this. I'm a jungler main so i know better why i abandoned J4, Zec, Aatrox, Nautilus and why (fun as he is) i never pick Maokai. Just ask some korean/na/eu challenger junglers if no one at Riot knows. **You buffed the jungle and promised to delay the minions spawn time but you never did.** This destroyed many junglers because they relied on being 3 when laners were 2. You wanted to remove the level3 vs level2 pressure from those champs (aatrox, j4, heca) and forced the emergence of even higher dps junglers (elise, lee, vi). If you wanna fix the pressure from these junglers just nerf their clear time/jungle sustain and not their damage vs champs. Aatrox who doesnt benefit from blue has to take it to reach 3 (might as well take another 3rd camp but it's not practical). J4 uses 4 pots to reach 3 without a leash with 21-9 masteries and ms quints. Zac and Heca get raped by the jungle by the time they are 3 without a leash (pretty much need to recall. Even with a leash they're not doing well because they are always low when clearing (**pots dont heal fast enough compared to the damage you take**, make a mastery to consume pots faster when attacked by jungle creeps or something) so running into another jungler means you're screwed not to say you have to wait like 10 sec to heal before ganking. Can you look into these jungle changes? Because you need look no further to find the reason why we, junglers, abandoned everything except elise and lee (can't play vi, i feel like i'll get dumber if i do). Not to say that losing a buff to an invade means you're screwed and you have to waste time (and 2 pots) farming double golems(what the mundo is that damage of theirs at lvl 1) to get to 3. I almost never do golems early, you only see this in LCS for w/e reason but it's not worth losing 2 pots for too little xp and cash. The **potions healing faster through masteries** suggestion should fix the viability of other junglers but you could instead buff the reduced damage from monsters basic attacks mastery, it's a jungle only mastery and it should compensate for the jungle damage. Ever since you changed the jungle i knew i will switch to Elise Lee and Kha till you fix it (minions spawn time???)... but boy 4 months later nothing is changed. Not all of us are Challenger to afford to play Maokai/Karhus jungle for fun, and thus we have to play what we perceive as being strong (especially in our hands because i just can't play vi for example, she's as boring as sona).
: [Hopefully 4.5] Gragas Rework Feedback Thread
New Gragas is **release Elise broken**, he's a revamped Elise that will poop all over top lane: ~~absurd~~ decent sustain, free MAX hp nukes every 8sec early game(basically FREE damage) and CC+mobility to setup ganks and follow up his jungler's engages. He also gets his damage reduction exactly when he goes in range to nuke people. And the low mana costs are a joke. **Overloaded kit much?** Take away the damage reduction and he's fine. **Items** (tanky build that leads to an absurd gameplay) * Void Staff (core offensive item to make sure the nukes hit hard) * **Iceborn** (cdr+slow+damage+armor) * Randuin/**Sunfire** (armor and hp) * **SpiritVisage** (mr+HP+cdr) * **Morellonomicon** to actually poop all over the enemy's sustain. Don't really need Athene with such costs. Goodluck escaping a neverending combo of slows, stuns and gap closers * 40%cdr * tanky * bursty * W cd = 3.6 sec (**3sec damage reduction every 3.6sec seems legit**) * E cd = 7.2/4.2 sec
: we can’t judge anything before we see his final changes live but we can talk about these. i am a jungler so i play panth in the woods long before we could use his W on creeps or monsters. • Passive: he really needed that change. he can block a turret shot why not a siege minion attack or a monsters attack. this will bust up his jungle clear power along with the proc of the agis of the Zeonia. • W: as for the changes of his stun duration. we should not look only at the first 2 but also the last 2 numbers.it hurts my fealling that they lowered his early ganks. we were a real threat and i don’t know how this will really affect our jungle play style • Grand Skyfall: this is where we have to say some things: 1. CAST RANGE: it was a matter of time that this would happened. If you remember the same happened to the old Nocturne ult range. It was the first thing I thought the would change on a jungler Pantheon(now we have to travel longer distance on foot) 2. CD: nothing to say you had to do it 3. CHANNEL TIME: I think this is the thing I liked most. a 0,5 from 2 sec make this ult almost untouchable. How many time we had this ult canceled by a lee sin? They giving as a better reaction time and also we can use it and as an escape tool. 4. LANDING TIME: this is where everyone is going to argue with. This is a change that makes the ult more difficult to land? Actually no. with a o,5 cast time you can your opponents in a better position. We now have a 2.5 sec to trigger and land that ult than a 3.5sec. the maths that this change is better is not on the land but on cast time. If everything else (spells/cds) will stay the same and if THEY HAD TO CHANGE Panth they are some kind of fair. The only thing that I personally didn’t really like and expected to see was the stun duration changes
His damage is quite ~~absurd~~ **manly** starting level 3 (reason he has very few unfavorable matchups top) and since his targeted stun can be followed up by another CC from his laner (god forbid it's another targeted CC), it's a 100% kill. Actually after a W AA E AA Q all his teammate has to do is ignite (esp a against a squishy) and maybe hit a spell. The stun changes are aimed at soloQ while the ult changes are aimed **ma**i**nly** at tournaments (where teammates sync on teamspeak/skype/etc).
: [4.5] Pantheon Changes
I'm gonna update my post from another Pantheon related topic since i actually played him meanwhile. I don't play him much (situationally top and mid but never jungle) and i hate playing against him jungle but he's not nearly as problematic as other champs. * Top he's a lane bully with about only 4 unfavorable matchups (but highly susceptible to ganks). * As a jungler his ganks are brutal. * As a support he's just faceroll esp paired with Lucian (because Panth, Lucian and Lb are the most obscene early game champs). *** I'm gonna aim my opinions at toning down jungle Pantheon's presence/pressure and not ruining lane Pantheon. **W - Aegis of Zeonia** * Even with the W qol change few patches ago he's not nearly as mobile as a certain manaless double dashing champ (that also has a stun and innate sustain). **R - Grand Skyfall** **note:** *as a **lane** Pantheon player i value the ability to cancel my ult if opportune* * **Range:** can be justified by some QOL changes (i'll throw out some ideas). * **Channel time:** * I like the 0.5s channel because it creates a more fluid (fighter like) gameplay for him in the context of his W gap closer being quite short ranged (compared to others in this age of mobility). * He no longer has a decent amount of time to cancel his ultimate (because nothing can happen in 0.5 to actually make you change your mind and still have time to react) and you took away the enemy's window of opportunity to cancel it (but he does pay for this with the range nerf). **Suggestion:** * Increase the channel to 1 sec (but i feel you could use this retune to really freshen up / fluidize his fighter gameplay) or * Keep the 0.5sec channel but allow him to cancel it even while untargettable (in the first 0.5s) but before the drop and increase cooldown to 30 sec or half it's full cooldown if self cancelled. It will be sorta like Elise's rappel: if he uses it to dodge a cc he'll still drop in the middle of the enemies (ofc there's that dead chain warden guy with his lantern thinggie) but he can also use it to dodge global ults at a cost (cd and mana).
: [Feedback] Pantheon's ulti change
I don't play him much and i hate playing against him but he's not nearly as problematic as others. * Top he's a lane bully with about only 4 unfavorable matchups. * As a jungler his ganks are brutal. * As a support he's just faceroll esp paired with Lucian (because Panth, Lucian and Lb are the most obscene early game champs). But even with the W qol change he's not nearly as mobile as a certain manaless double dashing champ. The stun changes are good, but he ult range is just... btw, when are ** * insert no skill broken champs here** (vinektoncoughcough) ** * ** gonna get some REAL nerfs?
: Suggestion for Bonetooth Necklace
I agree it feels horrible but the only reason you get that MS is to help jungle Rengar (top you'll rarely make use of it while farming/fighting), reason you can access it at only 3 trophies. If you would get the permanent MS later, at 14 tropies or so, that would be fine but it wouldn't help jungle Rengar. Permanent MS at 3 trophies would cause a lot of problems top and i'll explain. First of all the necklace is free (so it no longer needs to grant access to 800g worth the stats early). If he were to gain 15ms at 3 trophies then he would have to lose other stats. **Top Kitty** 15 units equals picking MS quints or roughly 9AD (that you give up by picking 3 MS quints) so i guess you can get 400g worth the free stats too early in the laning phase. He already has a decent MS (because he's melee) and bushes also grant him mobility top so everyone will delay tier 1 boots till they finish their first item (Tiamat/Hydra, LW w/e) while being able to stick to the enemy. When i jungle Elise or Lee i have a completely different state of mind then when i play them in lane. Rengar will feel even more distinct when jungling due to that added mobility that can't be accessed in lane.
: Give Night Hunter the Neon Strike Vi treatment
Yes please!!! Also, the colors are just perfect!
: I strongly disagree with your opinion of his E. "Bola is great for sticking to the target.. (probably too good)". Absolutely not. Against literally anyone with even a small amount of cc or mobility I can't touch them. The Bola is just too hard to hit for the benefit it brings. Its like playing Olaf with a less reliable Axe throw and no CC immunity. You just kind of have to live with hitting whatever you're in range of because you can't actually get close to the target you want.
You are strongly... unskilled. I'm really sorry that all those "no skill champs" mains are gonna drop Rengar because he won't be about mashing buttons but he'll appeal to all those players who like skill based champs: Leesin is so underplayed because of that Q (too hard to hit for the benefit and not hitting it means you sorta failed your gank). You lost all credibility when you said "it's just a standard skillshot CC with a long CD exactly like a Cocoon" implying they are somehow useless. Elise's E got nerfed from 1.5 to 1sec because a narow skillshot (that can be shot between moving minions by skilled players once youo learn projectile width and speed... i can do that with Elise/Lee on live servers) is "hard" to land and not rewarding. Elise's E is a 1sec stun. Empowered bola 1.8s snare + 0.7s slow afterwards. As i said, for skilled people it's satisfying... and i said there's room for tweaking everywhere, Empowered bola could be a 1.8s stun (that would still suck, right?).
: Lets talk Rengar
**New Rengar is less binary and feels better for high skilled players who like the idea of being rewarded for their skill**: hitting skillshots (especially at max range and in the FoW) and managing resources (**rawr**ocity). I never liked jungling Rengar but i love Rengar top/bot so my opinions are biased. * **Passive** The simple fact the ferocity doesn't decay is the difference between a failed and a successful rework. * **Q** No longer a turret wrecking terror, allows for better stats and i feel like using empowered Q differs from normal Q in more ways than just being "more damage". * **W** Improves his jungling, his presence in teamfights and his ganks (helps with minions aggro and tower diving). * **E **Feels so much better when ganking (no more different than Elise's E initiation) and it can be used a second time to finish off a low hp enemy that flashed barely alive. Bola is great for sticking to the target, esp empowered (probably too good). The projectile is narrower than the graphics, could you fix even if thou this is just a QOL change? * **Ultimate** Loss of MS while in stealth (before the 20 trophies) is something i didn't get used to in the short time i tested him. Ultimate is no longer an initiation tool (probably why junglers dont like it) but a way to finish off fleeing enemies and the ms bonus after the jump sure helps sticking to the target or running after a dive. If it proves to be too underwhelming in its current state (i can't say it does... esp at 20 trophies) i guess it could be improved: ignore unit collision or slow reduction while in stealth but losing those at 20 trophies... idk. * **Bonetooth Necklace ** Feels rewarding working your way up to the 20 trophies. **He is no longer an assassin** (his assassin play pattern was not healthy at all for the enemies nor did it feel challenging or rewarding for the players) b**ut he's not a melee carry either** (i was afraid of him becoming one after the rework). Some things could be changed and numbers tweaked but overall **the rework is going in the right direction**: his identity is being preserved, the mechanics of his skills all work the same and he feels less binary now. *** Shocking as it is, i'm not demolishing this rework like i did with the LeeSin and Skarner ones. The **Trundle, Karma, Yi, Sivir and Xerath reworks are really good**, **the Skarner and Leesin ones... not at all**.
: Cleanse is fine, Uzi's use of it on Vayne has shown us that much.
Cleanse it's fine as it but why pick cleanse if support always gets crucible and you can get QSS (that also removes suppress)? You need an incentive not just "yeah i want 3 cleanses" and that should be something that wiil prove useful in early engages (early jungle pressure, level 6 all ins, drake fights, that accidental red buff enemy adc got from my jungler).
: I'm not sure I would do this change as it repositions Cleanse as a diver/fighter spell rather than a nimble carry spell. This change makes Cleanse a very powerful initiation tool rather than a better escape tool - so what I'd forsee is that character like Udyr would basically just run at you and be unstoppable while doing so. While it might add breadth to the Cleanse spell, I worry that about the potential side-effects of this. We generally want Cleanse to be best on fragile / nimble characters. Their natural enemies are the heavy rushers who would benefit most from the slow reduction effects. It just seems like the side-effects might run counter to our goals.
When i wrote the post i had squishies in mind (marksmen and immobile ap) as cleanse users so you could add this bonus effect for ranged only (let's face it... smite is for junglers only, so enforcing cleanse as a spell for ranged champs might not be as bad). Melee shouldn't use it anyway. The only melees that **could** (but prob never will) use it are the squishy assassins and carries (however they should pick an offensive spell since that's their play pattern anyway) and they already have the tools (that gates their power) to chase/disengage in skirmishes (because in teamfights their support can use the crucible anyway) without having to pick up cleanse. *** alternative idea: * {{summoner:1}} **Cleanse** * after successfully cleansing a movement impairing CC, you are immune to the first knockup within the next 3 seconds * because: * knockups cannot be cleansed (a real advantage over the qss/crucible) * maybe (because you still need to cleanse a slow/stun/snare first) yasuo won't get this banned * naut players will get to use ulti as an initiation tool on the carry not save it and use it as a follow up (not sure if this will please everyone but the Nautilus issue was discussed last year and Phreak suggested ADC should get tenacity vs him and thou i don't disagree, **as long as the atk speed boots exist** and every other adc has atk speed steroids, seems **it's never enough atk speed you can stack**, even in LCS) *** Since i like the way you think and i remember you discussing WotA in the past (back when spellvamp was removed from spectral wraith) can i bother you in this thread to address the WotA changes? I play Elise and Vlad top (both on which i get this item each and every time) so i can speak from both the mana and manaless perspective: 2.5k is too much for a mana champ and the extra 500 gold has one effect: delaying the access to the extra 8% spellvamp because the extra damage i get is not worth on Elise. **Finishing WotA EARLY should be about self sustain** (glad aura is out) **and giving up on damage/defenses so this item doesn't need the extra damage** in my opinion. **From a manaless perspective** Assuming i rush WotA. 30AP extra means 7.5 more Q heal and 18more damage on Vlad's Q that should have 195/230 base damage by the time i finish WotA (roughly 10% increased damage). If i rush this item then it's my choice to give up on defensive stats (seeker's/negatron) and what i get for 500 more gold is not worth early on. **If i give up on defensive stats that means i leave myself open to burst and i adjust my play pattern accordingly.** The item gets more efficient than before once i get Rabbadon and Spirit Visage but i don't see Vlad as a problematic snowbally champ to actually screw his current power curve. If these changes hit live, i'll upgrade the revolver into WotA as my 3rd item (after i finish 2 of these items rylai/sv/zhonya/rabbadon/void staff ... depends on the enemy and what he's building as well as if i'm ahead or behind). *** The Q heal is actually 7.5 + max 1.5 (8% spellvamp off the 18 damage reduced by enemy's MR)
: [Planned 4.5 or 4.6] Summoner Spell and Enchantment Changes
*** **Suggestion** *** * {{summoner:1}} **Cleanse** * **"reduces intensity of slowing effects by 50% for 3 seconds"** after successfully cleansing a movement impairing CC (a knockback such as the one suggested in preseason would cancel channels i suppose so it would change the **purely defensive** nature of this spell). This would complement the current {{summoner:1}} because slow fields (Lux's lucent singularity, Trundle's pillar of ice, etc...) aren't affected by tenacity. This could also save you lategame from possibly lethal permaslows: red buff on marksmen, frozen mallet, Ashe Q - last toxic permaslow standing (make her Q cost no mana, last only 5 sec on a 55sec cd and give her a passive while Q is on cd... ignore unit collision or something). It would be nice for people to think in team select "let's see if i go barrier or cleanse this game" not "omg they have 5 HARD cc champs, MAYBE i should pick up cleanse this time".
: Is Trolling a bannable offense?
Picking w/e champ in a certain role is not trolling, it's actually some people that try to enforce the meta (and not testing anything) that end up ruining everybody else's experience on PBE. Example: some dude picks adc first and says we cant go 2 adc bot although he's not testing any ADC changes and i wanna try the latest MF changes. And there's also those guys who just try their best to make their team feel horrible (demoralizing teammates, feeding, not taking part in any winnable fights just so the team would lose). Feel free to report whomever you think he deserves it, Riot's handling reports individually so they'll get what's coming to them.
: Picking Heim in a rank game knowing his q is bugged and handicaps his potential and still want to pick him.
Well PBE ranked is about testing the ranked system not about winning. But knowing that but exists (or learning about it in team select) sounds indeed like trolling.
: I think the most significant problem we have here is that the Flurry Attack Speed buff is really hard to understand on paper, making the changes as a whole feel like we are sapping the life from Lee. Let’s approach the problem numerically first: Assume Lee Sin builds the most common bruiser/assassin build (which is AD/Armor Pen/tankiness etc. – items which support a pattern of quickly accessing the backline and surviving for a bit once there) in a game and he hits lv16. The PBE Lee Sin will have is 100%(his base AS)+45%(3% per level and he leveled up 15 times) +100%(new flurry)=245%(of original AS). Meanwhile, the Live Flurry values will leave Lee with 100%+45%+40%=185% of original AS. The difference here results in a 32.4% sustain damage increase from basic attacks if Lee can manage his passive in an ideal way. With so much more sustain damage, Lee Sin provides a higher damage threat to enemies after the first few seconds, without having to burst them as hard in the first one or two. It also means a 32.4% improved basic attack frame – landing auto attacks in between spells will be more feasible and more rewarding. I think your simulation of Lee Sin in a late game team fight is based on the fact that the Live version of Lee Sin is really weak at that point. Considering all the tools he has, why is that, and how does it happen? In a world where Lee Sin can deal meaningful sustained damage at all points in the game, you no longer are relegated to just looking for an ideal initiation and then having 80% of your job done. He can still have that meaningful initiation power, but the power it brings becomes largely about positioning, and less about the burst. After this point, he can use his increased sustain damage to remain a legitimate threat to the enemy team. Dragon’s Rage specifically is a really cool spell that provides a ton of fun gameplay, but as mentioned above, we really want to separate its use as utility versus damage. The current proposed Dragon’s Rage does approximately 50/55/60% damage compared to the Live version on cast, but it is increased by 50% for each enemy the target collides with. Under this paradigm, if you manage to kick your target into two enemy champions, it’s about same damage. If you manage to kick your target through his whole team, however, you will get a very noticeable damage reward (750 + 3.0 Total AD), resulting in massive damage to the original target. It’s definitely cool to Insec kick a high-profile enemy into your team, but the cool thing about that play specifically really isn't the damage you dealt; it’s the displacement utility you brought to your team. And while that play is cool, it has come to overshadow other uses of the ability in team fights. We want to reward players for thinking about the direction in which they kick their target. As far as the 1v1 case is concerned, Dragon’s Rage will deal 100ish less damage. This is absolutely significant, but the increased sustained threat from Flurry should be enough to compensate for that after the first few seconds.
Reason you only see Elise/Vi/Lee jungle is because you made the jungle hit harder and it takes 3 camps to reach level 3, burning more pots. Since you have the means, can you actually contact some Challenger **lane Lee** mains (from KOR/NA) and ask for their opinion? > I think the most significant problem we have here is that the Flurry Attack Speed buff is **really hard** to understand on paper. We're all HUGE idiots or you're very smart (and we should have no decent arguments against this rework). I think the most significant problem we have have is failing to understand that: * enemies ALSO scale into lategame, both in damage (burst esp) and defense (all carries get GA and/or Zhonya's). Carries get armor lategame allowing them to lifesteal and kite Lee to death if he misses his Q, without burst he'll have even more chances of becoming useless. * he is a caster, thus screwed by silence and other hard cc. **Tryndamere's ulti is usable even when stunned, silenced or suppressed reason you probably don't understand what a caster is.** > The difference here results in a 32.4% sustain damage increase from basic attacks if Lee can manage his passive in an ideal way. So you screw his burst lategame and want him to rezist more in a fight so he can output sutained damage. **Sustained damage against who?** A lategame Leblanc/Fizz/Zed who will 100-0 him with burst because now AD Lee (with randuin/sunfire and ga/banshee as def items) cant burst anymore? Against the really obscene lategame Vayne/Jax? Against unkillable Thresh/Leona/Alistar supports with low cooldowns on hard CC spells? Are you gonna nerf those broken lategame champs so Lee can stand a chance against them since he can no longer stop them from reaching their late? NO you won't! They are gonna be the same obscene lategame terrors because "they are weak **(against who?)** early"! Picking an early game champ is an assumed gamble (same as picking a late champ) and case u wont close the game fast u risk losing. > landing auto attacks in between spells will be more feasible and more rewarding. NOT for a CASTER! If hard CCed he wont be able to DPS because he cant access the atk speed without CASTING spells. Casters have burst, autoattackers have invulnerability (trynda) or CC immunity (Yi) AND no skillshots. Lategame you CAN'T afford to land MORE autos with Lee because **you already must land your 2 AA after each spell** to get your energy back or else you can't burst (so his burst is not really Zed like creepy). His passive is the reason why he is a high skillcap champ, requires a careful energy management and those AA are windows of opportunity that enemies can use against him lategame. This is clear both on paper and in practice to EVERY Lee player! Do you play Lee? >...Live version of Lee Sin is really weak at that point. Considering all the tools he has, why is that, and how does it happen? Because enemies scale into lategame (tank/**fighter???** supports become unkillable CC machines) and because that's the design of his kit. Unless he gets def steroids (like voli, shyvana, nautilus, etc) transforming him into the toxic bruisers with free damage and defenses Morello hates he cannot DIVE the enemy team lategame because any CC will be his demise as a CASTER (he cannot escape, **he's not Trynda**). > ...the power it brings becomes largely about positioning, and less about the burst. After this point, he can use his increased sustain damage to remain a legitimate threat to the enemy team. > ...the increased sustained threat from Flurry should be enough to compensate for that after the first few seconds He's not a melee carry with damage steroids (crit, increased bonus ad, true damage, nukes - yeah that's gone, etc) thus he's got nothing to gain from autoatacking. **Why does a Trynda main with 37 ranked games on Lee in s3 has to rework Lee?** Might as well ask Dyrus who plays only 0 skill champs (Rene, Trynda, Shyv, Mundo, Jax, Rengar, Darius, Vlad, Shen, Malph) do it! **Too much Trynda mentaliy in this rework and all of your arguments. RIP Lee! /ff**
: Let's talk about Lee Sin retune
**First and most important thing you should keep in mind is preserving his core identity: 1vs1er/duelist.** Lee is frustrating to play against (in the jungle only) due to his obscene mobility: in the 22 seconds it takes him to perform 2 sets of Q-Q and W (4 gap closers), other junglers can only close one gap (max 2). And he pays no price for using W on all the wards on the map because his energy restore system is the easiest of all the energy based champs. Since he's only extremely frustrating as a jungler and not as a laner, here's my opinion regarding your rework. I will assume in my damage calculations that i only get Hydra, BT and LW for AD Lee, last 2 items being randuin + ga/banshee making it 113 base AD and 231 bonus AD (only 8 from runes, rest 6% lifesteal) at level 18. **Flurry** **Lee is a CASTER** not an auto attacker so his damage comes from casting spells, giving attack speed to a caster is useless. The only reason his passive grants attack speed is so he can restore his energy fast. Unless you wanna remove the attack speed and replace it with something more useful in terms of dps, please don't insist on it (100% atk speed wont help much with the dps, will probably make his combos a bit more fluid but no one will waste time AA outside his energy restore system). **Zed style "bonus attack damage increased by a percentage" will help with lategame scalling of all of his spells.** If you dont wanna scale all of his spells then do one of the following: * 1st auto after E deals bonus damage equal to 50% of bonus AD (**115 AD**) to compensate for the **100 true dmg** lost on E lategame (it will be single target not aoe anyway so it will preserve his **1vs1 IDENTITY**) * 1st attack after a spell deals bonus damage equal to 10% of his bonus ad (so it wont scale for free with level) . This will work fine since it will give a nice lategame boost for AD lee only and it will be a reward for skilled players without being overwhelming, you can stack max 70% (160 AD) on a single target if u will try and proc all autos but you will risk creating opportunities for the enemy to run/fight/get help. **Sonic Wave/Resonating Strike** Changes are good **Safeguard** Change is fine, but since i'm an advocate of keeping the original Tempest damage or add more power to your version, you can add some Safeguard counterplay: reveal the ward (at least trinket) he jumped on for 5sec so enemies can kill it. I cannot stress how many times high elo Lees buy a ward 1st time back and drop it top/mid to use it again and again and again when camping that lane since his W has 9sec cd anyway... and ofc it pays off in the 3 minutes window. **Tempest** Don't change anything (lane Lee's only way to deal with armor stackers is the magic damage) or check the **Flurry** suggestion that works complementary to your version/nerf. New damage is 331 down from 431 but ignores 39% of enemy's armor. I'll calculate the effective **(true)** damage dealt to an Ezreal with flat mr/armor runes with and without GA by old/new tempest using 6% magic pen and 39% armor pen. * No Guardian Angel (42mr, 88 armor): Old 310, New 212 (98 true damage lost) * Guardian Angel (82mr, 138 armor): Old 241, New 178 (63 true damage lost) **Cripple** The slow decay fix is good **Dragon’s Rage** Change is ok but you could add a bonus for isolated targets (or when no other enemy champs are around) to preserve his duelist identity since this seems to bother everyone. I hope this isn't another "Let's talk about Elise thread" where people come with decent suggestions to fix the lategame fall off (adding bonus damage/armor/mr on her E as a passive) and yet you nerf early, mid and late without compensating.[ "Our data shows Elise's win rate has some of the largest drop-off of any champion as the game goes on in length."](http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=45132865#45132865) Now her stun is 1.5sec at level 15 when everyone should have tenacity. Make stun duration scale with ulti (1/1.35/1.75/2sec) at least.
: New Vel'Koz textures
I was expecting {{champion:161}} to have a dark, cold (silver/bluish not golden) texture for his armor, similar to the [Ing in Metroid Prime 2](http://www.videogamesblogger.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/metroid-prime-2-dark-world-artwork.jpg). Someone working at Riot is a bit obsessed with gold and purple... If brown, orange, yellow, pink and purple weren't the colors i hate the most i wouldnt't have noticed that 50% of the skins or splashes in 2013 (that purple in the nasus splash tho) are drowned in purple (pls STOP the purple Riot). Someone's also obsessed with ropes (vict elise, yasyo and now arctic ops varus), less ropes more belts, chains or ribbons.
: Toxic Players one Pbe
**Feel free to report everyone you feel like he deserves it!** Riot reviews the reports individually so fake/insignificant reports wont amount to anything while those deserving a ban will result in one. I remember some amazing bugs such as everyone except the spirit guard udyr players getting a bugsplat whenever udyr changed forms (this was back when SGU was first released on pbe). The other 8 players were trying again and again to reconnect and whenever i could get back in game the udyr was flaming hard about reporting us. There are lots of reasons ppl DC on pbe, there's also the simple fact **some queue then quit after testing the champ for a few minutes in a pvp**, this creates a very unpleasant experience. If he reconnected in the end then he wasnt **that** type of player. If you think you should report this guy then im sure you're new to PBE and havent met the worst of the worst... I have issues with people saying "leaver" or "pls report x teammate", so i would prob have answered the same way to your negative attitude (esp after trying for 10-20min to reconnect and/or repair the client). If he went afk on purpose and he said it in chat then your report alone is enough and you dont need to whine about it to everyone in both teams. This whining attitude defines the snitch with whom no one wants to play on the playground and case he gets himself into a trouble his way of escaping is "im telling mom". Just disgusting, grow a pair! @DeathByGod Meta isnt enforced on live, let alone on pbe, you can go 5 adc if you want. You were aggressive saying he isn't allowed to test what he wants because you wanna play the meta (go play the meta on live in ranked, or draf pick normals). Happened to run into ppl like you in team select when i logged in to test some changes to a new adc and some other dude calling adc first (my ping is 195)and not testing any changes at all flames me for wanting to do what PBE is meant for.
: Akali **relies** on getting Lich bane so that she doesn't falls off late game, just nerfing this item and not compensating on Akali's ratio is going to make her irrelevant late game, especially since Akali is not even dominant pick like the rest of the champions getting compensation atm, so idk whats going to be scary about that. Saying that Diana is getting compensation, most definitely means Akali needs one as well since they are both similar champions that have clashed many times into who being the better one (Diana being Akali 2.0 but better). Diana also doesn't rush this item either, she most likely gets Hourglass or tanky AP items first...so this doesn't seems to make sense at all. **This will just be a big in-direct nerf to Akali's Lategame when she doesn't even needs one. ** If you had to add compensation, the thing is that Akali does have an AP on hit passive: Discipline of Force, so she does falls into the category of getting compensated for lichbane nerfs. EDIT: I forgot to mention that Akali is a **late game AP hypercarry** since she has a **weak early game** therefore such adjustments will be needed to preserve it if Lichbane is going to take such a heavy nerf due to others making it a problem not Akali.
Gunblade Rabbadon VoidStaff are core items and with 2 slots left u need to choose between zhonya/lichbane/rylai (offensive) and randuin/banshee/ga/sv (deffensive) and trust me that each of the others is better than lichbane. If you cant snowball the game after gunblade rabbadon void then you should've gotten rylai somewhere in between (even after gunblade) because your isolated targets kited you all game long and you failed to snowball. This also means you cant afford not to get a deffensive item like rylai in order to stick to someone fleeing a tf or a zhonya + rylai in order to get deep after their most fed 1k range caitlyn (that chops ur team from afar and runs with her slowing gap closer case someone with a killing potential gets anywhere near) and survive to cleanup the tf. Her onhit bonus scales with AP so she DOESNT fall off lategame. It's like saying zed needs botrk in order not to fall off lategame but he gains 25% bonus ad from hs W passive and botrk actually kills his multiple burst potential as it only helps bursting 1 person cutting into your ad A LOT. Akali isnt a lategame hypercarry, lissandra is a lategame champ that cant do shit early. JUst because she has to wait for 6 prettu much like zed it doesnt mean she's lategame.
: Thoughts on Kassadin from a longtime veteran.
It is not Kassadin anymore because Kassadin is obnoxious to play against, so he has to stop being that: nuke people in a 1v1 situation without fear of retaliation. As an avid Kassadin player i know that only one of the following changes would really fix him without changing his ENTIRE kit: **1. Remove silence completely and keep same ulti cooldown same as now on live**. Removing silence requires replacing it with a defensive stat since he is melee... a stat such as this shield they are experimenting with or **being immune (or absorbing it like a yasuo wall) to the next CC** (fear/silence/poly/stun/snare/slow/knockup only) **and reflecting it** (have the champ that used a CC on you get affected by that CC). By absorbing i mean think enemy amumu wants to ult Kassadin's entire team but since kassa is there amumu's ult wont snare anyone but amumu (however team will take damage from amumu's ult). **2. Keep silence and change ulti cooldown to 30-25-20** (being melee, reducing the ulti range and keeping the current cd isnt a viable alternative since he needs to close large gaps) **and probably fixed internal cooldown** that cannot be reduced by runes/masteries/items. **3. A tempfix** would be moving slow to Q and silence to E as an AOE chogath like skillshot. They should've experimented this for the past 3 months if they didnt wanna Olaf him until the rework instead of ignoring entire playerbase and block a ban slot that could've been used on: **A. unbalanced champs** (mundo/gragas/shyvanna/vi/ziggs/leona/annie) **B. the latest released champ** (newest champ is always banned a lot until people learn his kit because riot cant enable him for ranked play in the next patch, same was for lissandra who is far from overtuned or top pick/ban now and recently released yasuo and vel'koz) **C. balanced champs with strong kits** that require skill to pull off amazing stuff but people have issues dealing with (thresh, lee, elise) **D. other personal preferences** such as the latest champ that stomped you (jax/vayne/fizz to name a few) or a champ you dont wanna deal with since he counters you or you're too tired to see his face (sry shittymo but sometimes i just dona wanna see ya).
: UPDATES for 02/20/2014: The following changes should be on PBE or deployed tomorrow: * Bots will be a little less confident under their own towers (though still fell pretty safe) * Bots will be more likely to attack closer enemies (slightly more than even the last change) * A number of fighters will now be more determined when chasing * Bots now re-position between auto-attacks. This is not perfect, but ranged bots should kite, and melee bots should try to stick to their targets. * Bots will now avoid Zombies if there is no reason to continue fighting, and won't waste spells on them * Bots will now follow targets that break line of sight a bit more realistically * Trundle and Miss Fortune have been updated * Updated intermediate bots now have revised item builds * Updated beginner bots now follow the recommended items
First of all, i must say i like the way they act in lane now. Also, the fact they now move erratically under their turret makes it hard to aim skillshots at them in order to CC/damage them (and often times players move like that when enemies are about to dive them in order to discourage the use of skillshots rather than trying to avoid them). Overall i'm quite pleased with the changes. Do you plan on changing the summoner spells on carries to {{summoner:4}} and {{summoner:21}} /{{summoner:1}} (for those without dashes) at a future time? {{summoner:14}} +{{summoner:3}} is simply... unrealistic and meant to mask how poorly they are programmed. You could make them use flash same way they do with ghost: towards their base when low or even aggressive if the enemy flashed/dashed and bots can get in range with a flash to secure the kill. This behavior can be tuned so they wont flash into turret range if they dont have enough hp (they could use barrier and even consider their teammate's shield/heal when they dive) or into skillshots already deployed and they could flash into the jungle in order to escape if they are between turrets. I'd like to see some changes in their pick of summoner spells and their use of those spells. Another thing i was pleasantly impressed with was them destroying the trinket i placed in their tower range. Keep up the good work!
: Blue Trinket was never designed for Parity. It was designed such that in a world with complete darkness, there was a trinket option that let you overcome that. I do have plans for blue trinket - but they're fairly low priority at the moment. There's more important problems to solve.
Can i make a suggestion? What do you think about 3 charges you can shoot fast (similar to the new Xerah ultimate) that grant half second of vision (and 2 sec of lingering sight)? Or there can be a 2sec pause between each activation, idk but mechanical details can be tweaked: number of charges, radius, speed if they are gonna be shot like the xerath ultimate (allowing enemies to get out of bushes). This way you could scan the 3 bushes leading to the red buff from the steps of your base (simply scanning doesn't help if u don't act on the result, so having 5 blue trinkets won't break the game even if some assassins might pick it so they can better stick to their targets). As it is now on live, buying 3 trinkets to reveal those 3 areas when you are behind and your vision's being denied (5 red trinkets in the enemy team) is not practical, reason ppl dont buy it in the LCS or in the challenger soloQ (not even in Korea, i've been watching a lot of Korean soloQ this week). The practical problem (beyond theories) with the LIVE blue trinket is this: i am NOT wasting a valuable strategic blue/red trinket slot for a single charge of vision on a relatively long cd when enemies can be in any of the other 2 bushes nearby. It's a trinket that should appeal to teams that are behind but it's not efficient in its current state. Yellow trinket is 10 times better even if u are behind.
: I see. However, a FULL 5-spells+Ult rotation is rather difficult to execute and should be rewarding due to that. I simply think his individual scalings are rather average, while both of his CC's are easier to dodge and his ult can be interrupted. I think one needs to discuss the Play/reward gain with him a bit more. I am quite a seasoned mid player and Vel feels rather easy to me, though, it may be due to his sheer power and/or misslespeeds and the like. I think one should be rewarded for making good plays and combos - but they might just be a bit too easy to execute at the moment. I think reducing the True damage output, especially at higher levels, is the best way to go. No clunky mechanics, no messy limitation - just a straight nerf because his damage is way over the top. Ult does too much damage on all levels I'd say. Too much potential damage at least. This is why I suggested that it does high damage at the beginning, with slowly falls off. Like this, it would still remain that bursty-ult feel, while one could also dish out heavier damage nerfs without hurting Vel too much. I think his early game strength is already rather high, considering you max W first. A 4-skill rotation is killing, but it should be - a 3 skill rotation also deals a lot of damage and can be executed rather easily by opening up with Q and then closing in for the E-W. And the rather powerful 2-skill rotation can even be executed right through minions, which I find VERY powerful. Also, for scalings: I most APCs have stronger scalings in there full rotation or "hidden" damage potential. Some examples... Orianna nearly reaches the 200% - more so if she hits the shield. However, Orianna got a Devastating CC ult, which accounts for some power, while her Q is on such a low cooldown that one could easily account for it twice. Ahri goes over the 200% if she hits EVERYTHING. A bit difficult to execute - but if she starts off with a charm, the 20% damage bonus needs to be added to her combos. Xerath can fire off his Q rather rapidly, gets over 200% if he lands a Bull-Eye W and if you account for his ult. Also, Xerath has even more massive range. Veigar easily tops the 200% by far(Think it was 280) AND gets free AP. Annie also overcomes the 200%+Her tibbers keeps on burning and hitting for damage for at least a few seconds. Heck, even Sona comes over 200% if you factor in Lichbane - and this is saying something. So~ I do not know where you got your statistics from or if you did not account for some other factors but in general, Vel has rather moderate AP ratios. If you account for only one cast of W, his whole AP ratios are actually BELOW 200% - but he has his passive to account for the missing damage. The full rotation has a lot of counterplay due to their being a short downtime between the W's and due to his CC's: E has a rather low range and slow projectile speed while Q is blocked by minions. Reducing an already low AA range really would feel bad, actually. If one tones down his damage and base defenses, he already would have a more difficult laning phase. For reducing a second W-cast - as I mentioned before, it is difficult to get off both W charges after all and skillful play should be rewarded. It may make him have a lot of damage due to his passive - but thisis where hard nerfs could be worthwhile in any case. A slight damage reduction would probably okay I guess - 20-25% should be good enough already. Strong play simply should be rewarded. Overall; i feel like nerfing his passive would go a long ways. His abilities, aside from his ult, are quite fine(Only other thing I would change would be to let the Q slow to be scaling per level from 50-70, but you already proposed that). Think I tapped on everything thus far. One thing you have not elaborated: Why the reduction of damage on Minions through W. Personally, I think that APCs should have solid waveclear - however, seeing that it is a double cast, I think you may be correct in nerfing the damage from it. Anyway, I would appreciate it if you could elaborate your reas
Vi and her "no skill required gapcloser + knock followed by a 1.5s suppression" makes it so easy for Velkoz to get a full spell rotation including his ultimate (same goes for amumu/malp/cho/fiddle). Just a number of junglers who can guarantee Velkoz hits ALL his spells at 6.
: Initial thoughts on Vel'Koz
I agree to all of your remarks and suggestions. Couldn't have put it better myself. But i hope he hits live as he is now... people will stop crying about Yasuo (they QQed about Zed but how hard was it to send a bruiser mid and stop him beyond any possible comeback) and Elise (8% current HP + 8% missing HP every 6 seconds, meanwhile Mundo has 25% current HP every 4 seconds... 37.5% current HP every 6 sec).
: [BOTS] Updated Bots Feedback Thread
Do bots still pick 4 exhausts and i'm gonna eat them all in under 1 minute? Because it's a frustratingly synthetic experience, no one is gonna pick 4 exhausts in a pvp. Exhausting you when they or their teammate is low only so they can escape it's just a lame mechanic to hide the fact they are poorly programmed. Bots offer no strategic challenge (once a turrets falls or at min 9 they start roaming, they ghost/exhaust to escape or chase a low hp target, they rush the most toxic items in the game: frozen mallet, iceborn, rylai and stack cleanse, QSS and banshee's on ADCs, etc). From a mechanical point of view, being exhausted 3 times in a row just because they have 4 exhausts doesn't feel like i did something bad nor is a challenger... just have to burst them when they are above 25% hp because around 10-20% they WILL exhaust and/or ghost. On a different note... can exhaust NOT reset your AA because it's already a STRONG enough spell? **If u get exhausted during your AA windup animation then** you cant even land that AA because **the animation gets cancelled** and there's a wait time correlated to the new attack speed before your next AA's windup animation starts! This is not a sort of "omg i dont want any bot to escape me" request, it's just that the bots have made me aware of the AA reset. Or **is this** intended exhaust behavior?
: [Suggestion] Featured game mode: lvl 18 full build start (5v5)
Same way caitlyn was pick or ban on showdown, this mode will be full of Karthus/Vayne/Tristana/Kayle (can this retarded champ get nerfed to only use ult on herself or reduce duration when cast on teammates and have its duration increased on selfcast?). Talking of lategame terrors who would probably populate this mode, since Thresh is broken strong and his lantern was buffed (wasn't sitting on it intended counter play to the insane range?... i get it that now since everyone has a trinket the ward on lantern hurt him) why isnt he getting a W balance: make lantern clickable 2 sec instead of 4, shield last for 6 sec and refresh shield if you click the lantern (this would allow for a thresh to max W in order to mitigate some enemy harass esp when losing lane, tradeoff would be playing quite passive and Thresh shines at playing him aggressive). Why am i even making these suggestions, it's not like a rioter will read or even consider these suggestions. I was thinking Veigar/Sion/Nasus could get few stacks as well (not too many thou). Overall i like the idea, i also think this will help identify broken champs (Mundo/Shitvanna took 10 patch cycles to tune down A BIT, because they are both still retarded compared to many many many other tanks) and hopefully Riot will react faster with balancing. I know i would like to test lots of other champs (and see how they're doing in the current environment) without having to play games i lose/win at 20 with barely 2 finished items.
: [Suggestion] Team Builder: Specified bottom lane roles, reduced team captain powers.
First of all, let me quote [this post](http://community.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/c/gameplay/rs2UH7R5-team-builder-is-coming-back-soon-tuesday-121-at-100-500-pm-pst): **Role selection (used by Captains to search for players) is currently limited to "Any Role"!** So the feature exists, just not turned on in this testing cycle of the Team Builder. Secondly, having a team captain ban 3 champs he wants in soloQ is retarded **(*)** yet riot wont increase the number of bans to 5 per team so that every player can ban 1 champ of his choosing **(*** *at least let us each suggest a ban and then vote 3 of the 5 suggestions* **)**. Maybe this would make the game less frustrating due to the fact there are more than 6 champs out of control that need banning, not to mention there are other bans except the broken ones such as those balanced but with strong kits (lee, thresh) or hard counters case you want to play a certain champ. Morello said it doesn't matter the number of champs in LOL has doubled since season 1 (thus more champs out or control/balance during any given patch cycle). Fairplay (or a sense of equity) defines the competitive environment of any other sport and game except LOL, better catch up to the news. If riot cared about being fair they would punish ranked afkers/feeders/trolls by banning them from ranked till they play 20 normals or so. So i guess vote kicking is a no. Why would riot be more fair and democratic with a normal game mode than with ranked?
: Jinx's Kiting with Pow-Pow!
Her basic attacks animation while using Pow-Pow consists of multiple projectiles, but only 1 will hit the target and damage it, rest are there for the enhanced visual effect. Has nothing to do with kiting... No bug here.
: Magic penetration (%) cap.
%penetration adds multiplicative (not additive) Adding 35% with 6% penetration leaves you with **Magic Resist equal to (100-35)*(100-6)/100 = 61.1%** which means **38.9% penetration**. Adding 35% with 4% penetration leaves you with **Magic Resist equal to (100-35)*(100-4)/100 = 62.4%** which means **37.6% penetration**.
: About Annie support being picked frequently with the new support meta
I never played Elise mid and i was a beginner back when she was released. She didnt seem as a good mid laner. Her execute potential, insane range gap closer and the stun being a skillshot made her a strong top laner not mid laner from the very start... **It's also her scaling and kit that allows only for a bruiser build at higher level of play**, full ap Elise doesnt work because **she depends on landing a skillshot stun, she has no easy/reliable escape (after bursting someone in a tf) and most of her dmg comes in melee form.** Top is not a bruiser lane but a lane for champs who can benefit from chasing and executing the enemy (gap closers, cc, nukes) and Elise fits this perfectly, so does the new Kha (his rework made him a better top laner: nukes and early level slow). Yasuo with no free cheezy escape, no CC and inability to do decent dmg if built tanky is not a suitable top laner for this same reason: he's susceptible to the top laners that can chase (close gaps/cc) him and build defense and still do dmg. You can play whatever you want on any lane, it's just some champs get an advantage from playing top or mid. .
: Question about current particles on Zed. (Serious thread)
You can describe it like this: the 3 shadows that converge on the target marked are missing their trails. Actually CertainlyT answered another similar post of yours (about a month ago, when Yasuo was still in the testing phase on PBE) and said he'll look into it (into restoring the trails i suppose).
: but Annie isnt intended to be a support...Annie's ranges are so low for a mage already.
For a burst mage with hard CC and def steroids (E) who can deploy the stun on a target based spell (Q) or as an aoe (W/R)? Due to her 625 range on her Q no ADC except Cait can safely farm outside her range, so early game Annie can stun you with Q then flash+WR to burst you in lane, no skill needed there to make it a 2vs1 bot lane then turn on the enemy left.
: As a mid Annie main I couldnt disagree more with this(all of it)...what Support Annie needs is a Pyromania nerf not a range nerf or a Damage nerf....other way you are just destroying Annie mid too. I think the best option is, nerf molthen shields CD or make it so it doesnt add stacks to the passive....this way, Annie cant farm the stun while being on a bush, she has to last hit minions to do it(0 cs sup cant do that).
Elise top was destroyed too by tons of nerfs cause it was simply too strong. Sorry to say it but your "you are just destroying Annie mid" argument does not stand. Same for Zyra mid, she's "destroyed" mid, compared to how she once were, all due to her being played support. Ryze mid is fked due to Ryze top.. and so on.
: Have utility supports become useless?
And RIOT's still buffing Annie (reduced CD for Tibbers at later ranks to compensate for the stun duration nerf). As soon as Annie stuns she insta bursts the enemy even if the stun is 0.25sec not to say that the ADC can follow up with his CC (cause being a no brain role... ADCs being ranged is not enough, 90% of them have quite potent CC) but usually after Annie's combo the ADC needs only AA few times to secure the kill. Nice Tibbers buff, now i cant wait for Flash+Ghost Annie as soon as the new spells hit live. When asked on this forum if double Targon wont be an issue, some Rioter said: we dont expect ADCs to give up doran's for targon cause they'll lose trades... yeah right. Can you guess what happened as soon as Targon hit live?
: The kassadin changes were great
**Move the silence to his E** (aoe skillshot silence like Cho's W) **and the slow to his Q**, adding counterplay to his silence (flashing behind him as soon as he blinks or even flashing farther away from his E). While his silence remains target based, he will silence his target denying flash or any form of retaliation other than AA and erase him/her. **Main issue with Kassadin is that you dont need ANY skill to R+Q+E+W.** Burst + 5sec blink + target based silence = TOXIC binary pattern (binary meaning you either combo your enemy or you don't, not that you have 2 possible combos). I know Morello hates labeling certain obnoxious patterns that lack counterplay as toxic but if something's toxic in this game then it's Kassadin, Yorick, AP Shaco, AP Sion and Annie (for being able to hold a stun for 50 minutes then insta-erase you). Can't the stun expire in 1 minute if not used?... is that as difficult as it was changing Yi's Q to physical damage (that took over 6months, thou he was stomping SoloQ from bronze to diamond). Issue with Annie is same as with Kasadin: no skill needed to pull out a combo without counterplay. Thresh was fixed so he can't flash+Q (single target and shorter duration stun than Annie's), meanwhile in every challenger/d1 stream Annie is a pick or ban and all i hear is: **x seconds to Flash+Tibbers**. **WAKE UP RIOT!** and buff Tibbers some more, eventually allow Annie to stack 2 stuns if she spams E 3 times after she got her first stun.
: Co-op vs. AI is naturally disabled in the PBE because we are encouraged to play ranked or normals with other people. If you want to experiment with builds or just practice some champs you don't have on the main servers, you can create a custom game against bots and play on your own or with some invited friends who also have PBE accounts.
Say what now? I have a PBE account since aug 2012 and AI games have been disabled 2/3 weeks ago, **Co-op vs. AI games are not "naturally" disabled on PBE**, you have no idea what you're talking about. PBE is a testing environment and you are meant to test every aspect of the game since some bugs may only manifest in Co-op vs. AI games.
: It's been here for some while and what I have understood from it is that it's intentional. I'm not sure though, can't find those threads very quickly
No, it's not intended, **it's a bug if they reset** (start healing). **Ahri **(charming) **and Fizz** (becoming untargetable with E) **are NOT supposed to reset jungle creeps**... it was fixed (so they wont resets buffs) sometime in the spring.
: New client feels akward + how to fix
First of all i think **the new client interface is an improvement over the live one**. I would go as far as to say it's a progress in the same way the s3 in game shop was over the s2 one. 1. I agree to the HOME suggestion, although im sure in time people will get used to clicking the logo to get home, after all we all use lolking and lolnexus and they're not endorsed by riot, if anything... news travel fast within the LOL comunity. 2. I like the fact there's no box between the logo and the play button if there are no notifications. Ffs the interface is finally a bit more breathy... with the lastest skins/champions, news and livegames already in the main window, who needs them redundantly featured on the top bar? I'm sure **most** of those buying RPs actually visit the Champion/Skins sale link when it's up on mondays and thursdays. Makes sense for the Title of the announcement to be written in a fatter font than the content of it and on a blue/red background as well.
: Give Sion some love, similar you did to Mundo
There's an in-depth "Sion rework" thread [here](http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3377077) that contains some of Morello's thoughts on the rework.
: Rengar Collar {suggestion}
Rengar is undergoing a rework, more info [here](http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=39813745). You'll notice that atm some of the Bonetooth necklace changes are these: **Recipe:** Hunter's Machete + Long Sword + 100g **PASSIVE:** 20% Increased damage to monsters
: Ahem, as the person who designed Thresh's kit, I never intended to him to be able to Flash mid-cast. It never even occurred to me that the spell would fire from his end position, not his start position. But with all that said, the change wasn't made because we didn't intend for it -- unintended cool plays are things we as designers love to see players come up with. We removed the Q+flash interaction on Thresh because that combo was not consistent with the gameplay of the ability -- it has a long cast time to make enemy dodging more possible than with typical skillshots. Q+Flash broke that.
Seeing as Thresh is one of my favorite champions (the other two being Zed and Elise) and i enjoyed Flash+Q... i always agreed Flash+Q was too strong considering the stun duration is long enough for him to dash at the target's location and all in. I remember a Rioter saying it's intended behavior a few weeks before the nerf but it wasn't you (don't remember who and no point in digging the dead) and im glad to know it was never intended. If there's anything i can say about your champs is that they're well thought and allow highly creative people with good instincts to make amazing plays. Were you involved in the rework of Zed's ultimate? Because i have to say it's better than before (less damage thus more challenging) and allows for some sick plays (especially the recast range).
: Yasuo Ult problem
I have a feeling it's intended or they missed it but will probably be the first thing they'll hit when they'll start the nerfs and we'll get the "it was never intended" talk we got when thresh's Q cast during flash was removed. It was said Q+flash is intended behavior since his release but in his [Q nerf patch notes](http://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/patch-38-notes-0) they shamelessly noted "Fixed a bug where Thresh could cast Flash while casting Death Sentence".
: Spectral is not the worst. have you ever used it on evelyn? That item makes her ridiculously stronger early game if you rush that item before anything else and in the current meta eve is amazing. as for it only working with junglers and smite you hardly ever see a jungler not run smite, it's a huge loss in early clearing without it.
I said it's the worst in the spirit series. Since the Golem is the best i suppose you'd argue elder lizard is the worst but at least it's a viable pick on most dps junglers, unlike the Spectral. **Spectral is the worst because it addresses like maximum 5 AP champs** (because their jungling is simply obscene due to their insane DPS/CC if they are no longer mana gated): eve, amumu, fiddle, cho. It's a bad/weak item on diana/orianna/karthus and other ap with mana issues because by the time you can afford it you're are way too behind due to the whole mana issues. Spirit stone's hp/mana regen allowed for diana/orianna to actually work well mid/early and make more ap junglers viable. Spectral is also a very bad item on manaless AP junglers (like Zac/Mundo). If the heal was 20% at least and mana 8% i would probably pick it. **Since the old spectral was never a top pick on Elise/Zac in LCS** (spellvamp has great synergy with nukes and smite) i would conclude that the 20% spellvamp was never attractive, so why would Riot think that 8% (monsters only thus no teamfight potential) spellvamp would be?
: Please don't remove the Spirit Drain passive from the Spirit Stone items
I was looking forward to seeing how the new stone panned out live, mainly what junglers will start to see play (that rarely or never saw play before) but guess we're back to same 20 top picks as s3. We got support items that force (by giving an insane advantage to support lanes over non support lanes) the support meta so why not fix the jungle problem by admitting the meta exists and improve the jungle items for smite owners. **You can fix** (this season and not in season 5) **the issues junglers have by simply enabling the passives from the jungle items only if the player has smite**, this way the jungle items can get some decent stats without them being attractive to laners. Spectral is the worst **in the spirit series** and unless you're cho, fiddle nunu... it's not worth it since any other ap items is better as a 5th item late game (where you need combat stats and 50ap is too little). No one is jungling late game since mid laner/adc poach blue/red and even the other 3 camps.
: My biggest concerns with AP Yasuo are: 1. Access to substantial spell vamp off minions. Combined with his passive shield, this could lead to less interesting laning phases. 2. Lack of integration with the full kit -- Intent is literally unused without crit, and Last Breath's bonus armor pen doesn't matter to AP Yasuo. 3. Sweeping Blade is exceptionally reliable. Part of Yasuo's feel is supposed to be the unreliability of his combos and the enemy's feeling that they can play the same elusive dodging game as does Yasuo. So while you may enjoy the build, I as a designer have to think about all parties to the game when deciding what to incentive and what to discourage. 4. Samurai + Deathcap is dissonant. If I were new to the game and was laning against Yasuo, there's no chance I would think to stack MR. As a teammate of Yasuo, I am unlikely to presume him to be a magic damage dealer at champion select and so may select a suboptimal champion to fight alongside him as. Of course player communication can mitigate this, but design is a practical exercise, and perfect communication is not something that can simply be assumed. The AP ratio on E was meant to make certain off build items like Triforce feel fairly effective. I had hoped that the cooldown would keep AP Yasuo non-viable. At present, it remains to be seen whether the build truly has merit, but I am inclined to lower the ratio on E if it does prove viable outside of casual games. I know you and others enjoying AP Yasuo will probably find that statement frustrating -- as a player who enjoys "off" builds myself, I can sympathize -- but these decisions require balancing the interests of game health against player expression.
I think his E is fine but **you could cap the AP damage at 100 no matter how much AP he builds** (you could buff lucian's AP ratios back to his first PBE days as well this way), Trinity + current baron buff should be fine within that 100 ap limit. This isn't hard to implement and **though this hasn't been done before, with his W you proved you're open to options you'd never considered before**. Regarding your 4th post i'll speak from experience. Ninja+AP is dissonant, made no sense to me back when i was a beginner: akali/shen/kennen being AP made no sense to me (esp shen). Illusions and acrobatic moves (that should translate into skill based abilities: gj on Zed) define ninjas and not magical powers. Acrobatics and illusions call for an AD scaling champ, Zed is actually the only ninja that makes sense. As for the magic damage on his E 1. a beginner is not playing ranked or draft pick to see him picked by the enemy and if he is it's common sense they should keep up to the spells of a new champ, after all it's not like we get them (new champs) every 2 weeks anymore. 2. when you die you get a death recap and if you died from 9k magic damage then you will know what to build, and someone playing ranked should at least have knowledge of the death recap screen. 3. since he's not a hybrid (to be prepared for quite some magical dmg) and only 1 of his abilities deals magic damage AND it's not a ranged ability i don't think he can nuke people in lane before their 1st recall, at which point they already see him building AP (runes and startup item). Aa for pre level 30 pubstomping i can assure you there are waaay bigger issues there: katarina, fizz, akali, leblanc. And what's really unintuitive pre-30 is Tristana and KogMaw building AD but dealing magic damage exclusively with all their spells, Kog even has nukes.
: Isn't Lulu suppose to be creepy?
Right on spot! She's meant to be creepy, now whether she looks creepy or innocent that's a different story but she looks creepy in her first 2 skins as well!
: [Gameplay] Yasuo, the Unforgiven
He already has a VERY weak early game and rushing shiv is the way to go since his AD ratios are not the best (his pattern is based on sustained dmg so he cant have high AD ratios) and building BT first wont give him any burst. Lowering the crit early would lead to him buying a BT first and having same power level most marksmen have early game but without the safety and escapes (cc+gap closers) those marksmen have. You are melee and TARGETABLE during all of your skills so you can get locked easier than yi or trynda and his only gap closer is his ult, E is not that much an instagapcloser. If you can kill a fizz/zed/kha early with him, as he is now, then please ask for nerfs on his crit... but be honest: you cant evene scape them, let alone kill them. He's far from the recently buffed (why buffed and not nerfed?) instashooter Fizz!
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