: uhm no, just delete quinn as known and give her a new kit. she has just to much of roaming an ganking potential. with her stupid blind, an good played quinn even outplays and malphite easiely. and malphite with his passive on bonus armor should be an real counter to quinn, but malphite the god of anti AD just isnt when it comes to quinn. nah, please fully delete quinn and reworkd her. same as you did with evelyn, or mordekaiser, or other very original League of legends champs. just delete quinn and make her some irelia 2.0 boring type to play champ, and we're all good then. i promise!
Youre not wrong, she just has an awkward kit that doesnt work with the items/where league has gone
: seriously can we get a quinn revert please?
Shes an awkward one. I was thinking of champs earlier that need a rework, and she was the major one i thought of. I dont think her kit is necissarily the issue, its more what the fuck is she suppose to build? There arent any items for her since they brake jayce/kha. Shes been pushed into a ranged assassin adc, kaisa is sort if the better version of quinn w/out being over bearing. I liked the older kit better tbh, but i think shes just that champion that proves how much not having agility as a stat hurts us. Its hard to buff adc/ad casters without making the other op.
Rioter Comments
: Glad to know what you guys think on your end there. I wasn't saying much on the passive as I figured it was kind on the weaker side in order for Ahri not to be a bit to overloaded, as I seen a post on the earlier passive ideas having AA dmg reduction on it which was removed likely as it was to strong. Personally, I'm happy you all tried a route with adding the MS back in, so it didn't really mattered to me much that it not as strong as I would of liked it.
My thoughts too Also so happy to see you guys on here!!
: ahri feedback, I loved passive movespeed but have some advices
I agree, it doesnt feel in line with the power level passives usually have.
: My thoughts on the current update on Ahri.
My thoughts exactly. Although, I think they could scale the passive up as the game progresses. Still gives the enemy time to gank her, but makes it feel more impactful. Right now it doesn't really feel on the power level of what passives usually are =S
: I loved her this week, She is just what I need now :D her passive gives her movespeed upon dealing two damage with abilities. :D I hope it comes to live. I hoooopeee
mhm, again I think she's fine on live as is, so I look forward to crushing people. If I can just land those pesky charms lol (why the fuck are gold players so hard to hit with things...).
: And also, is there particular reason for it to not scale with levels? Feels odd that this ability does not progress with Ahri in any way.
This is actually a very valid point. It would make it more impactful in the later stages of the game without making her too safe in lane. Hell make it trash early and have it scale into a monster later.
: ahri, leb feedback for this week pbe,
I agree, I think we've finally found a comfortable change for her that will increase her power without being overbearing. The w might actually be better than live for good players.
: > [{quoted}](name=PBE ENLIGHT,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=RE7LFoaR,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-04-04T10:59:43.919+0000) > > Ahri: I have loved the new passive and that q stack of soul essence. I overall loved ahri a lot. she is still having that passive movement speed and it is not that easy to use it, you have to do hit some abilities to gain . I think these changes are the most proper changes so far. > Leblanch: I think adding the most damage into the q and rq consume is the best way to avoid leblanch to simply q rq to oneshot squishy targets especially adc ones :D. I see the damage there but to get that, you are forced to consume the both part of q and rq. that is much better for leblanch. I can't actually access the new update even though I have downloaded the new patch.. what's wrong with my client? ;-;
There's been some connection issues with it xD
Rioter Comments
: ahri current changes feed back
I agree, it is a bit overturned xD Especially with the mana passive she could just spam abilities and never drop below half. They removed one form of insane safety and added another one... With how clunky the w was, it didn't even really add any damage. Left her exactly the same as live lol
: Hi, I'm not agree with you for new Q passive. Q speed passive are extremely helpful in laning phase ( specially for eventuals ganks). Without Q speed passive, probabilities to use R for escape from bad situations ( in lane and not only) were increased. R will become a defensive spell for wide part of a game.
The healing passive is just a little bit too strong; I personally prefer live, and maybe just lower her mana costs a little bit for q/w. The passive speed on the q is very fun, and I like that it's in the game a lot (it just feels like it fits). That being said it does give her a huge safety net that prevents them from adding any tools/damage to make her have more of a threat. She really just needs a way to create pressure. I think the easiest way to do that would be to add either a lich bane or a burn effect onto her next auto after her w, and have it work on turrets and champions. It gives turret pressure and allows her to whittle enemies down so she can have more kill pressure, but it still gives enemies a way to react. https://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/client-new-features-feedback/NEuiKBJB-ahri-changes This is a little bit more in depth on my reasoning behind this. Would live any feedback on it though.
: Sorry, this is a discussion better held of the live servers. PBE boards are for bug reports and feedback on things that are *currently* in testing.
I believe it's calling for changes for a specific champions, but I'm not really sure which one it is.
: I apologize if English is not your native language but this reads like you made this post with your phone using speech-to-text while you were suffering from a cold. I come close to understanding what you're saying and then it just goes back to being an incoherent mess.
: PBE toxicity
I didn't think it was that bad 0.0 I would just mute people that do that xD probably bronze into diamond matchup, so i can understand the frustration lol.
: ??? They're adding the damage amp in exchange for the Q Movement Speed boost. In fact, it seems you're not understanding why the changes are taking place: Ahri is too safe, but can't carry. Even fed, playing with Ahri is just a "hold my lane and wait for being carried", so when ahead, you can't take advantage as an assasing-mage champ, but when behind, you don't get punished that hard. So they're adding damage and taking away the MS, that provided so much safety for her. Still, they're not aware that the real issue is her W.
Yeah, we understand these things. The dfg charm is even more frustrating to play against though xD I'm okay with them taking the movement speed away from her, but the things that they've been adding into her kit seem very random... They tried to slow down her damage by slowing down the w, but that made it extremely hard to weave it into combos. It also made her very predictable and messed with her csing. https://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/client-new-features-feedback/NEuiKBJB-ahri-changes These are my ideas of what to do for her, pretty small change, but I think it's enough to give her that last little boost she needs. I think she's still very strong, but you don't get to make many mistakes with her in a game Dx
: Re-Adding Damage Amplification for Ahri's Kiss is a Bad Idea
I don't think the dfg charm is outside of the current power level in the game, but I agree that it is frustrating for opponents and is questionable (players shouldn't be punished like that for being hit by a single ability). Especially since they made the w so clunky it was unusable xD. I like the changes you put up, they're a creative while still remaining true to the champions identity. I had similar ideas for the w when I was brainstorming, but it's nice to have an ability that will aim itself too. I don't know that she needs to be completely overhauled (or that they are up to all the work that would take...). I think her real issue is a lack of pressure to force decisions. https://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/client-new-features-feedback/NEuiKBJB-ahri-changes this is my idea on it if you'd like to take a look over it. Would appreciate your thoughts on it!
Rioter Comments
: Riot just doesnt care about their game anymore. They are the main reason why players leave.
I know, Right? xD
: I understand they want changes... but they really need to balance out the meta before they make more changes because, so many thing right now are unbalanced and forgotten that by the end of this season(if things arent balanced) so many champs and abilities will be broken. They are not the Riot Games i once knew. P.S they should take into consideration that a lot of players are absent due to fortnite's popularity and should really hold back on adding things until they get WAYYY more feedback.
That's what I'm saying, they don't even pay attention to our feedback xD These forums are nothing but a formality to them. Like if I've played a champion for six years, unless one of their testing team is a one trick for the same length of time. I probably know them better lol. Side I don't think those players are going to come back xD
: Yeah... it just doesn't feel like they actually play the game at all. They change abilities at random without an fundamental understanding of how a champion works. Complete ignorance of their nuance. I swear I do their job for them half the time, but they're too arrogant, or to ignorant to understand that they aren't qualified to be making the changes they do. xD Hell I'd be fine if they just asked pros how they wanted the game to work, and go with that. To be fair, it is a very complex game. Biggest issue is the lack of an ability to distinguish between ad carries and ad casters (ie agility).
I especially like the amount of attention they give to these forums... lucky if they look at it once a day xD should be like someone's full time job to be looking at them
: Hell if i knew buddy. I dont play lux often or main her. but i know when a bad buff is incoming. Riot just never listens. They need to realize that NOT all champs will be meta or in competitive. Them pushing so hard for all the champs to get buffs is breaking the game to a point of where we only know whats OP. This is gonna prob be the worst season because of Riot's lack of impatience & coordination when it comes to balancing champs.
Yeah... it just doesn't feel like they actually play the game at all. They change abilities at random without an fundamental understanding of how a champion works. Complete ignorance of their nuance. I swear I do their job for them half the time, but they're too arrogant, or to ignorant to understand that they aren't qualified to be making the changes they do. xD Hell I'd be fine if they just asked pros how they wanted the game to work, and go with that. To be fair, it is a very complex game. Biggest issue is the lack of an ability to distinguish between ad carries and ad casters (ie agility).
: But right now, get kills or not doesnt mean that she will be stronger. An Irelia 1/0 and other 8/1 have the same effect. The only way that change her impact in the game is the player's skill, and I think it is unfair.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean. An 8/1 irellia will be exponentially stronger than a 1/0 one just due to the item advantages. That's the difference between triforce+cleaver or whatever; or luden's echo+lichbane or whatever. She'll have a very good time of preying on her laning opp, or other lanes. As long as she presses her advantage, she should be able to carry. Champions like irellia/ahri/ect aren't designed to carry the player, rather they give more options for player skill to influence a game. Champions like Garen/annie are designed to be simple, so that basic knowledge is more important.
: The Irelia's Rework Problem
She looks pretty insane either way imo. She has very high outplay potential, so wonderful for one tricks (which i feel is a lot of her current playerbase anyways). A few ad ratios wouldnt hurt if shes truely strugling, but i see her being in that broken if youre good with her catagory.
: Lux R CD
Thats what they do though xD what kind of changes do you feel she needs? Shes sort of a hard one to do anything with since her kit is pretty streamlined and works well together. Probably the only thing to do would be tweaking numbers. Maybe higher passive damage to help her get ahead better without overloading her teamfight?
Rioter Comments
: Ahri Q speed passive.
yeah I'll miss it too. She's just so mobile already that it's hard to leave it in if they want to add the dfg charm back in, but I think the dfg charm is probably necessary with the direction the game is heading. I was hoping to see more done with the w, or at least the changes reverted to it (which I'm assuming they forgot about lol).
: thanks for the feedback :P i think you're a bit wrong there, S4 ahri's kit had plenty synergy (which happens to pretty much be the "first round" they put). and this is a tad too safe, again people forget one of the **main** reasons Ahri is being reworked in the first place. It's because she's too safe, that's why she lost her Qms, giving her prectically infinite mana and health in laning is safe, probably even safer then her Qms on live. moving it to W will simply cripple her mid-late game, a better option would be to make the healing scaling by level so it's weaker early and the same late. or just reduce the numbers, i think the dfg window is really fine, and just wanted to correct you a bit again: charm **does NOT increase her auto damage** and it seems you contradict yourself a tiny bit, saying this is "not ignorant of her playstyle" and lets her "have more than one playstyle". i appreciate your opinion but please don't make it sound like it's the universal truth or something :P im also a bit against touching Ahri's passive, as it's one of the most useful passives in the game and i don't really want to see it as part of her other abilities (why can't Q be just a regular dps skill?) but that just my humble opinion on the matter{{sticker:sg-ahri-2}}
That's kinda the champion though xD All of her matchups are skill, and she does a little of everything, but is only master of mobility. They could change the scaling to make it comparable, the healing greatly effects laning and it sounds like it would be more impactful to have decisions made there. That's what usually makes or brakes a good ahri player anyway. Really, I just wanted to see any change to the w. When they removed the range to it, which they aren't adding back for some reason..., it made the ability very lackluster. It has always been sort of a boring ability, and I just wanted something to add some spice into it xD My mistake on the charm, thought I read all damage for some reason. The window might be fine, but five seconds is a long damn time xD Only change I would see is maybe making it four seconds. By ignorant of her playstyle. What I meant was, She has enough in her kit to burst one target, and enough to deal good ambient damage to surrounding targets. If you add a cd reduction onto her ult, then it makes her kit have the capacity to burst two targets, and deal insane ambient damage to surrounding. It completely breaks the champion, any changes that are made to her should revolve around making her abilities better or more useful. I probably should have said something more to the lines of ignorant of the champion as a whole. Her kit is very open and allows for a lot of decisions on how to approach combat. Which is one of the reasons I love playing her. Maybe it is a tad arrogant to make that sound like the end all, but those changes were the most broken thing I've ever seen added to the pbe, including release leblanc. I really didn't want to see her banned every game. I wouldn't call it the most useful passive, but it was a fun little minigame to manage throughout the game. The new one helps her out a lot, but it is very very lackluster. I like the one that I saw, where the person wanted to have some sort of a stacking mechanic. Then the next attack on an enemy champion would do more damage and heal her, basically draining their health. Made more sense stylistically too. Honestly they could just reduce the mana costs and leave the passive alone... xD Like you already need to hit her abilities to be useful, why build that into the kit xD Was there someone who was missing everything, but now that the passive rewards you for hitting people, they're like "OOOOH that's what I was doing wrong". Yeah, we were already going to use the q all of the time, you don't need to add anything more too it lol...
: i think the new ahri changes and passive may be a little over tuned
I personally like the changes, but they may need to back off on the numbers. Charm in particular feels like it has too long of a window to throw in abilities/autos. I would like to see the q passive moved onto the w, and reduced in numbers to account for the lower cd. That way it's a little less powerful in lane, but it will keep her healthy later. Interested to see where they go with it though. It's certainly got a lot more synergy than the first round they put up there, along with feeling more well thought out (also not completely busted and ignorant of her playstyle xD). This is probably the best way to help her overall, and still leave her to have more than one playstyle.
Rioter Comments
: I personally enjoy the Charm amp version than the Ult change version tbh. It feels a bit nicer to me at least, since her damage isn't negated with time spent on trying to do damage. When you fight ADC's who can end the fight in 3 autos, damage being negated by time starts to feel really bad. If one of the changes has to go through, then my vote would be the charm amp.
The charm amp just always makes issues with item balance, at least we don't have to worry about dfg stacking with it anymore xD The ult change is an interesting idea, 2 combos in a rotation would result in two dead targets instead of one. I guess it just comes back to, "does she need it?" And I guess I was on the outlier in that issue xD By all means if everyone thinks she needs a buff, I will gladly take it lol.
: not really, she is still squishy, and CDR on ult won't save you from someone that can burst you down. it feels broken but against players that know how to counter it, you can be countered very easily. kite ahri will require items like rylai's (maybe even the old roa+tear build) which give less damage but more hp and kiting potential while assassin ahri will take items that help bursting others but be very squishy and easy to focus down and kill.
The issue with the ult giving cdr, was that she would get to combos chains. It's insanely good if you're behind, but if you get ahead with her, that just means she blows up two people instead of one. I think she has too much mobility for them to give her too many tools to kill off opponents. If they want to change something, the ability to look at is her w (something they've mentioned in the past). My idea is just to give her next auto after using w, like a lich bane effect, or maybe she throws a fox fire at her target and it burns them (after the regular foxfire starts).
: Ahri changes again
They've removed the changes lol. They were not even close to being ready to look at her. They're gonna need help if they want to balance her without either irritating the fan base, or making her absurdly broken
: The changes to Ahri are meant to make her deal more dmg but also become a more risky champion. Too often are Ahri's just using ult to escape, so adding that thing there encourages people to use it aggressively. Right now, she is medium risk medium reward. As an assassin, she should be high risk high reward, so these changes are made with the intend of doing that. These changes will punish passive Ahri players while buffing really aggro Ahri players.
I think being a good Ahri player is more about knowing when to be aggressive and when to be passive. This change is going to make a good Ahri player completely unstoppable, and it's going to be very very frustrating for enemies to deal with. The only thing these changes do to make her more risky, are in lane, but aren't going to change how she plays in the later stages at all. If people feel she needs a buff, I'm all for it since I think she's fine at the moment xD. I just don't want to see her perma banned sitting at 62% win rate.
: If you really feel like she didn't need the change. Then you wouldn't be complaining on my post on how I did not like the change. And calling people misguided or what. Again, you're just going only with win-rates which is very annoying in a statistic point of view. You take all of whats going on, not just one thing and say you're right. Besides, these changes aren't meant to buff ahri. Its to move it around to make good Ahris do better and bad Ahris do worst in terms of skill caps. That way she won't be just a safe pick with high win rate for meta jumpers and still be good to play for Ahri players. That part I can agree on. But I still get to say in my point of view if I like the changes or not since I'm one of the Ahri Mains that are actively playing her regardless of game state for her.
Sorry, that was more for the people commenting on your thread than you specifically. I think your points are valid, and I share them. Although I played extensively during the dfg charm phase, and I feel like we need to advocate for the rest of the playerbase who have forgotten how annoying it was to have her come out of the fog of war and one shot everyone just because she was able to land a single ability. I suppose I'm just astonished that they would put all three of these changes together, The change to her ult would be insane on it's own xD.
: hi... i'm ahri player for long time... i mean. LONG TIME. i know you wont ask my opinion, but, here i go. I think this is SO GOOD for her. it is not so broken, but helps alot. when i'm playing ahri and i could not kill a target, i safe a R charge to wathing my cds back, so i dash again and trying to finish it. this cdr will make it more easy. so more dynamic. 1 or 2 seconds, makes difrence for any assassins. for somepeaples it doen't make difrence, but i does. R Rd changes is the best thing the could make after E damage increase
Yeah, this change is busted as hell. It's not a matter of addressing a perceived issue with her; this is just ridiculously overtuned.
: Ahri Feedback
Thank you! I feel the same, and I think she's fine on live xD
: Ahri Needs the higher delay time (0.6s) on her w for charm amp to work cohesively
what do you think of the ult cdr redux? I'm with you on the delayed w, it doesn't really change anything, just makes it easier to ult-w champions honestly xD I think the entire kit is busted as hell (I was the same one to flame people on redit who thought the q movement speed was bad lol).
: My thoughts on current Ahri changes.
You all are hilariously misguided... xD I'm gonna go out on a limb and estimate 62% winrate
Rioter Comments
: feedback on Ahri
These changes as are, are busted as fuuuck. like even just with the dfg charm it would be too much. The cd reset on the ult is so mindblowingly overpowered I don't have a clue how it got on the pbe... Strait up, just stand back and watch how good echo is on her, and then decide after you get solid numbers... Edit: I looked back on op.gg and she's back down at 50.9% winrate. I suppose she could use a change, but I still think everything they put on the pbe is insane
: For any rioter who may stumble across this thread. please here us out. I'm a long term mod over on Eve mains discord with 700k + mastery and a lot of love for the champion. Over the past week a lot of talk has went on between hundreds of members of the community. This is the most well spoken and summative post we have yet to see which encompasses near all of our concerns and problems we have felt out in the kit. Please take this one seriously.
They didn't listen about Diana; hopefully they listen to you guys >.<
Rioter Comments
: Diana Changes!
I don't believe it reveals stealthed units, but it might depend on the type of stealth. I played her into akali recently, and she would be marked, but she didn't get revealed outside of the silhouette her shroud reveals when you hit her. I've also played her into khazix recently and I don't feel like he's revealed from his ult either. Would be interested to know any other interactions though, and it would definitely be nice to have that clarified.
: Having it on her e was one of my thoughts too, I've been playing her a lot lately and I think that would shore up her weaknesses without putting her into the oppressive category. Her damage is pretty frustrating when you get ahead, but she gives absolutely nothing when behind. I'd be fine with her having a bit more utility in her kit and lower the damage a little. It looks like they want to turn her into a triple attack rotation champ when they eventually rework her. Which I'm not against, but her kit doesn't currently support it. They just need to wait on that portion of it until they're ready to go all in. we've been talking on the posts here, mostly me asking around trying to get a good idea of what other people think as I can only speculate on the way I play. There was a decent amount of comments on @Ricklessabandon's twitter, but I felt like they weren't as thought out. Mostly knee jerk reaction, or people who liked the champ but didn't have a good understanding of how she works.
https://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/q5EtiUYL-630-pbe-patch-diana-changes This is the post I had up when they announced the 6-30 changes (I've done a few now as they add more information xD (must resist urge to make another)). I just updated it to reflect what I think are my final thoughts on what they should change (until they rework her).
: It would not change much since she still does not have the tools to get close enough to CC someone with her E. I could see some sort of mouvespeed buff after casting her E so she can position properly not on her W. The main issue with Diana,s ganking power is her ability to gap close having no speed boost or dash/blinks pre 6. Even though you made a good comparison with Ekko, he, on the other hand, has a gap closer pre 6 (his E) and a telegraphed AoE stun. I could see Riot trying to make some interaction with her abilities and Moonlight, but to be honest the easier way to fix this right now would be the give her a big movespeed buff towards champions with Moonlight. P.S. Can you link me the Reddit post/place where you saw the discussion, I am interested in what people were saying about Diana and how they would approche her kit
Having it on her e was one of my thoughts too, I've been playing her a lot lately and I think that would shore up her weaknesses without putting her into the oppressive category. Her damage is pretty frustrating when you get ahead, but she gives absolutely nothing when behind. I'd be fine with her having a bit more utility in her kit and lower the damage a little. It looks like they want to turn her into a triple attack rotation champ when they eventually rework her. Which I'm not against, but her kit doesn't currently support it. They just need to wait on that portion of it until they're ready to go all in. we've been talking on the posts here, mostly me asking around trying to get a good idea of what other people think as I can only speculate on the way I play. There was a decent amount of comments on @Ricklessabandon's twitter, but I felt like they weren't as thought out. Mostly knee jerk reaction, or people who liked the champ but didn't have a good understanding of how she works.
: While i can agree on the flat 20% attack speed and the +30% after a cast. I dont think a stun after her E would change alot. I would prefer giving her more stick potential and a pre 6 gank potential. A 0.5 or 0.25 second stun on ult cast with moonlight on the target along side the CD reset could be a possibility only if you can allow her to have her ult pre 6 dealing 0 damage. I would also like to see the old interaction of being able to Q while dashing but only if you have it frame perfect. In a sense that old mechanic fits well the aspect she has to have to cast every spell at frame perfect to have her maximum burst potential. (Having to W while casting R to get the 3 orbs to all deal damage instantly or casting E while casting R to have it knock people mid dash)
having a stun on her e would change everything... It would give her gank potential in top/mid/jungle giving her a similar strength to something like ekko. The other thing we wanted was movement speed that quickly decays on her w to give her an easier time of getting into position to combo someone. I wouldn't mind seeing the r-q again considering the damn thing hates resetting under normal circumstances xD
: Hi! Fellow Diana main here!! I dont know if you wrote your comment before or after the second changes. I have tested the new changes on pbe, (Not the whole attack speed on her E passive but the one with 20% on her passive and a boost to 50%-90% on her E) and to be fair it is good. It doesnt change her early clear AT ALL given the fact that her old passive was 20% BONUS attack speed, so unless you ran attack speed runes and masteries it doesnt change her early clear at all. As a plus, she now gains 4 mana every third auto attack which is pretty good the more ap you build (15%AP as mana restored). Now you might want to get her E third in the jungle compared to the either W Q W or W Q Q. The only bad thing i noticed is later into the game, its clunky the way her attack speed works because their is a lockout after you cast an ability so you cant instantly get an auto attack (around 0.5 second or something). In the end, you do her clear like Lee Sin, you Cast a spell, do 3 aa, then cast another. It would go like Q, 3 aa, W, 3 aa. Hope it helps you understand a bit more how it changed her. (Slighlty more base attack speed early could be good for cooldowns, but not too much or she will become a power house in the jungle clearing departement) P.S. I could do a basic clear aka Red/Blue - Wolf - Blue/Red
general consensus is, that people would like them to just leave the passive attack speed alone, and have her e just flat increase it for 3 or something xD feels so bad in lane... Jungle might be different though if that's where they're trying to push her, but I think if that's their intent they should seriously consider the change we've been pushing for having her e consume moonlight and stun the target. We'll see what they continue to do though
: I've checked your ideas but you're turning her into 1Q= 1 death, with both her dashes, a stun, passive auto activated if you landed Q before and E stunning, there is no way that an enemy can escape from you if you landed a Q.
Her ult consumes the passive, and I don't think you can start the e before that happens. If anything maybe change it so that the e also consumes so you're forced to choose between reset and stun. Good point though (also wouldn't mind a slight hit to her damage so she's less frustraiting).
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KittyKatAhri

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