: Unfortunately, as per [this tweet](https://twitter.com/KateyAnthony/status/1189237464889729024), Riot is not collecting feedback on the True Damage skins.
> [{quoted}](name=Amy Sery,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=IAfsNEYf,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-06T10:16:10.690+0000) > > Unfortunately, as per [this tweet](https://twitter.com/KateyAnthony/status/1189237464889729024), Riot is not collecting feedback on the True Damage skins. if project:jinx is anything to go off of, it's not like they would havce listened to feedback anyways
: > [{quoted}](name=EternalSerb024,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=VjzggaaM,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-27T02:13:00.949+0000) > > Okay, has URF hit live yet? no, does that mean we should just assume its properly patched and not bugged? absolutely not. As long as URF isn't on live, that is time that should be spent bug testing. This is how everything else works on PBE why should URF be different? Second, how the fuck would the new champ have their balancing tainted by URF when by the time she hits PBE, URF will be gone (because it's hit live and will get any more bug testing on live). > > Additionally, you still haven't addressed my core argument. Maybe I was unclear in which case I apologize. My point on "it doesn't need testing" being a bullshit excuse is not targeted towards URF specifically, but content in general. You are mental retarded...........I did address it, No longer needs testing simple nothing more needing said...you sit here and argue with me if you want shitty urf back so back go blow up the post from the rioter that im quoting that "We having cycled urf and feel it no longer needs anymore testing" braindead fucking twat....
ah what a well worded and structured argument "you are mentally retarded". Real quick, do me a favor and google the phrase "ad hominem fallacy." And of course, PBE only has things that still need testing, that's why there's 2-year-old skins on the server (which aren't in the store), and why there're 5-year-old skins on the server and in the store, because those need testing still. Now if you scroll up, you will see what a response looks like when made to someone who A. Focuses on the argument, not the person B. Gives well structured counterpoints and C. Is actually mentally capable of recognizing a heavily flawed argument.
: Example - Changing some runes, f.e. Conqueror, could have the unintended effect of making Namis ult be available at level 1 without cooldown. Making it a necesity to have all of the games content available when testing is done. Thats what the PBE is for. Which is why they run URF on the PBE, to see if it at all starts, and to see what other things it will break, so they can then fix those, in URF, and in the other modes as well. And after bugs (significant ones) stop appearing and it is gameplay ready without major issues they can remove it from PBE as they know that patch of the game will work that way when it hits live. (Optimally - however things often break even when they shouldnt, ergo why things can work fine on PBE, but break as they hit live and so on.) Coding is a funny thing, since you can make an error on Kaisas files somewhere, which doesnt affect Kaisa at all, she works just as she should, but that error on Kaisas files, somehow affected Darius Q to make it global range, but only when he has bought Trinity Force and Sunfire Cape, and then refunded them both to buy Deaths Dance, in that order. Thats the fun thing about trying to code stuff - things can be seemingly completely separate, but still cause issues, which is why you want to keep as few things as possible when you test things.) Which leads to one of the reasons it was removed - because of the other changes they put into PBE - which will need testing and such - and those will (likely) be on a different patch than what URF will be when it hits Live later today/tonight. So it would simply put more work on their bench for no real reason, and would make pinpointing the cause for potential bugs a lot harder. And thats the reason for PBE, to not make Live crash all the time. (you see it all the time in games with less extensive beta testing for patches, the patch drops and the game is unplayable, not saying it doesnt happen here, but remove PBE and then enjoy all these absurd bugs LoL gets in your ranked games) See it in the way of cooking food - If you put in one spice at a time - and taste it each time - you will know which make it go bad. Vs if you were to put them in several/all at once, in which case you wont know which one made it go bad. And since URF has been tested and working, they remove it - so that they can test the next batch of changes, so they dont have to test these next changes TWICE, all because you want URF to stay longer. *PS - your "core" argument of removing what doesnt need testing - is whats been done when URF was removed - everything else has to stay (as they are permanent in the game, it working as it should is completely inconsequential) - otherwise you would have no idea how any changes would affect those things that arent there when its all put into one patch (Que the hypothetical nami ult thing above). **PBE isnt there to be played - it is there to see if things work before they are played** _(played=Live)_
uhhhhhhhhhhh...There really isn't anyway to respond to this that doesn't make me look like a moron. Wait no there is! You sir...are correct, this entire time I have been pretending that there would be no problems caused by stripping every champion from the PBE (aside from ones who received changes). This is entirely, 100% bullshit, if you were to remove Sion from PBE it could (for no goddamn reason) somehow fuck up kindred's code in a completely unforeseeable way. Granted I've been using this shitty argument mainly because there's no problem with it logically, but code sometimes breaks for no apparent reason and it's really hard to fix a problem you don't know is there. Though it has been rather entertaining watching this other guy flail his ad hominems at me because he doesn't realize the simple fact that removing blitzcrank from PBE would almost guarantee he or some other champion launched with a bug (because the code won't fucking listen). Now don't mistake me, this probably came across as sarcasm. It's not. My arguments are full of fuckin' holes, pretending they haven't been would be delusional. They're mostly focused on addressing what I see as flawed logic behind "it doesn't need testing anymore" rather than actually accounting for the intricacies of coding (and the problems that would arise from disabling champions). Most importantly, as I see it, "it doesn't need testing is a problematic argument." 5-year old skins do not need testing but are still in the store. 2-year-old skins don't need testing so they aren't. Why are certain things exempt from the "doesn't need testing" banner but not others? As far as I can tell, "it doesn't need testing" strikes me mostly as a tactic employed by Riot to get everyone comfortable with doing their work for them so they don't have to pay people for it.
: > [{quoted}](name=EternalSerb024,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=VjzggaaM,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-26T20:31:53.652+0000) > > Ah, so what was the point in even putting URF on PBE. They've said themselves that people get burned out on league from URF so wouldn't it make more sense to not release it anywhere before it hits live in order to keep people from burning out? > > Also, you still didn't address my core argument regarding the simple fact that Riot's reasoning is bullshit, if they want to remove things that don't need testing, they should remove **everything** that doesn't need testing. > > Don't think I didn't catch the fact that you once more tried a condescending ad hominem in the form of that "little new to the boards" portion. A good attempt though. > > Now, because this isn't my core argument I'm addressing it last > > self-righteous: having or characterized by a certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior. Youre not right thought..........Its a rotating gamemode. it rotated and now youre upset because you wanna play urf without having to pay for champs. There is too much new content coming out in the next week or so for them to have urf to worry about.....and honestly the last thing i would want for the health of a new champion is URF tainting her balancing period
Okay, has URF hit live yet? no, does that mean we should just assume its properly patched and not bugged? absolutely not. As long as URF isn't on live, that is time that should be spent bug testing. This is how everything else works on PBE why should URF be different? Second, how the fuck would the new champ have their balancing tainted by URF when by the time she hits PBE, URF will be gone (because it's hit live and will get any more bug testing on live). Additionally, you still haven't addressed my core argument. Maybe I was unclear in which case I apologize. My point on "it doesn't need testing" being a bullshit excuse is not targeted towards URF specifically, but content in general.
: Im not gonna debate im an asshole....but Self-Righteous?!??!!?!?..........Also i can tell you're a little new to the broads my guy so ill inform you a tad bit.........All they did was convert it to URF from ARURF which has been on the PBE for 2 months+ they had no need for telling after the first week because everything was already ironed out
Ah, so what was the point in even putting URF on PBE. They've said themselves that people get burned out on league from URF so wouldn't it make more sense to not release it anywhere before it hits live in order to keep people from burning out? Also, you still didn't address my core argument regarding the simple fact that Riot's reasoning is bullshit, if they want to remove things that don't need testing, they should remove **everything** that doesn't need testing. Don't think I didn't catch the fact that you once more tried a condescending ad hominem in the form of that "little new to the boards" portion. A good attempt though. Now, because this isn't my core argument I'm addressing it last self-righteous: having or characterized by a certainty, especially an unfounded one, that one is totally correct or morally superior.
: Bugs can come and go with any champ given a change......in fact just the removal of URF could cause a problem with a champion due to some coding getting crossed up. Your logic is you wanna play every champ for free in the special gamemode because you dont wanna grind or invest to do it on live.....well i got news for you guy that isn't what this server is here for...its to make sure changes are tuned and stable enough for live servers so you can climb you're shitty iron elo without having a yi become immune to damage due to an unexpected error. URF has been vetted if you would like to continue playing the featured mode you can on live servers this 28th which runs till the 8th of november and the ("{!Rotating!}") gamemode goes back in the vault for the next one to take its place ^ Had to make sure you saw that word right there
Apparently, (this is something I was unaware of) after Riot declares something has received enough testing, that means that there is no chance whatsoever that it could possibly need more testing at all. Additionally, URF (a mode that makes extremely drastic changes to the game) will definitely launch perfectly fine with no bugs because our Riot overlords said so. Also, we need to be sure to make space for rotating game modes more than a year ahead of time (last rotating game mode was one-for-all in early april 2018) because **rotating** means once a year apparently (wow, incredible). Now I need to employ a practice you have demonstrated, Claiming that someone is Iron and trash at the game seems to automatically invalidate their opinion so I must declare that you are obviously an iron IV yasuo main who regularly goes 0/50 by the 20 minute mark. And no, my argument is that if Riot wants to argue that once something hits live it doesn't need testing, then anything that has not received changes in the current patch cycle should, by that reasoning, be removed from PBE because it no longer needs testing. You simply proposed this straw-man so you could have an argument to try to counter instead of backing up your own. Don't think you can just move the goalpost and I won't notice, that's just a shitty thing to do. Additionally, You are a C O N D E S C E N D I N G, S E L F - R I G H T E O U S A S S H O L E ^ had to make sure you saw that phrase right there. TLDR: rotating game modes don't need to leave within a week if they're not coming back for another year; supporting your argument by insulting the other person is both a shitty thing to do and not an actual argument; as long as something is unreleased, it should be fair game for bug testing; Misrepresenting someone's argument and countering your strawman is not valid.
: This is unrelated to the client. The link system as described above has been in place for 6 years.
true, but now because of the new client, you cannot have both PBE and live open simultaneously. This part is purely the client and whether useful or not, it means less functionality. The new client has less functionality (on top of IMO just being way more boring but that's subjective).
: URF has been tested and enough feedback has been given for them to make any last minute changes..
ah yes, "we don't need testing so they removed it" by this logic, most champions and skins and runes and ARAM and custom games and replays, etc. should be removed from the PBE because they have no changes that are in need of testing.
: They are different servers, but just like NA/EUW/all other live servers, you now use the same launcher and as such cannot be logged in to both at the same time. "Linked" only means that Riot knows which PBE account belongs to which live account. Aside from that, the PBE and live regions have no way of interacting with each other.
Sweet, new client, less functionality.
: Because believe it or not, PBE is for TESTING, not just to enjoy yourself, why don't you try out the preseason changes and tft and actually do what pbe is for ? :)
honestly you're right, so it seems like the logical next step is to remove all the champions who don't need testing, all the skins that don't need testing etc. Oh right nothing new in ARAM, better just get rid of that, nothing new with custom games, better to just disable those too, all these old skis that don't need testing, not only do we not need them in the store, we should remove them from the server entirely just to make sure people are only using it for testing, right? If Riot wants testing done, they can pay people for it. If they want us to test **their fucking game** for them, they damn well better let us enjoy doing so.
Rioter Comments
: Unavailable skins
Once again, 0 comments, 127 views, keep it up guys. Keeping the threads silent isn't going to make me stop. You wanna downvote, that's fine, but it's definitely preferable for you to actually do something constructive.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=EternalSerb024,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=ybohiu8c,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-09-04T15:13:53.734+0000) > > Yes, you are correct, you can get these skins by buying copious amounts of lootboxes. Because Surprise mechanics are fun and an enjoyable system. While its true you can buy lootboxes to unlock the skins, I don't really consider that an acceptable reason for keeping the stores so clearly inconsistent across live and PBE. Honestly this point is more or less impossible to argue objectively seeing as it completely comes down to whether you're comfortable with lootboxes being the only way to get the skins you want. I am not. I think lootboxes are a terrible system that shouldn't be employed by developers to block off any content, including cosmetics. But if you are, more power to you. I personally do not like loot boxes at all. But its pbe, so you dont spend money on it.
I mean I'm sure most people have been doing that since the store is fucked. But my whole point is that the status of the store is all a matter of user experience. Currently the PBE feels like "your reward for being a nice person on lives is that you get to do our job for us!" because of the honor requirement and the fact that the server suffers from all these user experience problems is inexcusable. For like a week, invites were broken. They very clearly do not give a shit about user experience on the PBE and its honestly reprehensible imo. The whole matter of the store comes down to "if Riot wants to act like PBE is a reward for honor 3, it should actually be fucking rewarding us for helping them." Blizzard's test servers are available to anyone who has the game, overwatch ptr, hots ptr, etc. But Riot seems to expect you to work for the **privilege** of making **their** game function properly.
: Lootboxes exist, especially the premium boxes, which are only available on pbe, do grant random permanent skins instantly with a chance around 40%, at least that's what I have experienced. These include many, many skins which are not buyable anymore.
Yes, you are correct, you can get these skins by buying copious amounts of lootboxes. Because Surprise mechanics are fun and an enjoyable system. While its true you can buy lootboxes to unlock the skins, I don't really consider that an acceptable reason for keeping the stores so clearly inconsistent across live and PBE. Honestly this point is more or less impossible to argue objectively seeing as it completely comes down to whether you're comfortable with lootboxes being the only way to get the skins you want. I am not. I think lootboxes are a terrible system that shouldn't be employed by developers to block off any content, including cosmetics. But if you are, more power to you.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: The PBE is not a reward. You may choose to interpret some of it as a reward, or find ways to reward yourself, but the PBE is not a reward. The PBE is a testing environment and **volunteer work.** You are volunteering to play on an unstable server to find bugs and give feedback on new features. The PBE is not a treat for players, the PBE is not the ideal place to play, the PBE exists for testing new content as volunteer work. The return of RP was not solely for players benefit. With a steady income of RP, Riot no longer has to do special pricing in the store, which solves several issues including potential mistakes when shipping content to Live servers, overloading the store when people want to buy content (since they are limited in how much the can reasonably buy now), and testing content which may not be coded to be sold for BE. In your original post, it was addressed the champions with a Visual Update do need their old skins tested. This is absolutely true and this is a point that should be argued, because far too many updated champions don't have their skins re-released to be tested. Anything that is updated or new should be opened up for testing. However, old skins do not need testing. The chances for content that hasn't been changed to be bugged and for that bug to not already exist on Live servers is so incredibly minuscule is that there is no point to stress about it. Since there is such a negligible chance there, it is better to have people focus less on old content they want to play around with and direct it more to new content which does need testing. There is content that needs testing but isn't enabled or available. That is absolutely an issue that needs to be raised and fixed. Old skins aren't part of it. That is something that will generally be much more productive, because Riot does not have a good reason to go out of their way on something that isn't what the PBE is intended for.
Alright, so first, it's volunteer work that players have to reach a certain level of "honor" to get. Arguing this is volunteer work, would be like the Red Cross demanding that all of its volunteers have earned a nobel peace prize. If you have to reach a certain rank of human decency, and then you are allowed to join a different server (which is by this system fairly exclusive), it sure sounds like a reward (congrats, you're not a shitty person, here's a PBE account. And then, your reward for doing something (which mind you most companies hire people to do) that Riot needs done anyways is a Sense of Pride and Accomplishment for letting **them** get **their** content tested without having to actually pay anyone. But this doesn't get into the bigger issue, this server was treated as a reward when we first gained access to it, we were given the ability to purchase skins with a daily grant of RP and they weren't artificially limiting what we could do. The server stopped being treated as a reward when a bug occurred and Riot realized that by screwing us over they could get their testing down without having to pay or reward anyone and began trying to screw us over by removing shit from the store for no reason (you may argue that it was "because it doesn't need testing" but it takes more effort to remove it than to just leave it and keep your players somewhat happy.) Riot is doing their damnedest to limit what we can do on the server and I'm not one to take it lying down. It is true that the return of was motivated by riot not wanting special pricing, I don't disagree with you there. I think though that the greater motivator was the fact that after six months there were still 2+ posts a day asking about RP. Riot was most likely sick and tired of seeing the boards cluttered with complaints and decided to correct it. Lastly, you are correct that Riot doesn't have a good reason to go out of their way to spend time on something the server isn't meant for but there are two major counterpoints, the butchering of the store in the first place (going out of their way to screw over players because "it doesn't need testing anymore (fuck the players)" and Riot Skitteacher.) So first, there was no reason for riot to manually apply the effort to remove skins from the store just because it doesn't need testing. If the server is only for things that needs testing, why doesn't Riot literally remove everything that isn't new each patch? Finally, Riot skitteacher said that they want the server stores to be consistent so either that was a lie or riot are really bad at doing the things they want to, seeing as this was six months ago I'm inclined to believe that Skitteacher was just making excuses since "we don't give a fuck if our players want to have an enjoyable PBE experience as long as they do their jobs as guinea pigs" doesn't have as nice a ring as "We try to keep store content consistent across Live and PBE to mitigate risks." Sidenote: Thank you for giving a well constructed argument for your point, I wish more of the people who disagree with me were more like you. It would make this process more constructive and feel less like a waste of everyone's time.
: thank you brother, keep up the fight
hopefully more people will join the fight since I don't see one person making much of a difference. That said, I have no intentions of stopping anytime soon.
Rioter Comments
: PBE is an enviornment to test "new" skins, not old ones that doesnt have any bugs, hence when a champion gets reworked, all their skins are on release
You're right, that's why baker pantheon was absolutely 100% available for testing. If you were to go back to day 1 you'd notice I addressed the fact that baker pantheon, despite needing testing, was not made available. My more recent posts have all been including a link to the day 1 post as I realized it'd be weird to make people go back through the days to get a more in depth assessment of all the problems.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Unavailable skins
If you disagree with me, Then please go ahead and explain why you do not believe this is an issue. Because if you're just going to downvote and move on, then you are an asshole who has added nothing constructive to the conversation. I have no problem with people disagreeing with me, go right ahead, but if you're going to do so, then have the dignity to explain why you disagree. Or you know, just let Riot get away with intentionally limiting our options as much as they want so that we can't have any reward for helping riot do **their own** fucking job and keep **their** game functioning.
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
Rioter Comments
: Baker Pantheon does need testing. Just like all other Pantheon skins. Riot just tends to forget to enable the VGU skins ¯\\\_(ツ)_/¯
I never said it didn't I used it as an example of skins that **do** need testing but can't get any because they're not available. Also, "sorry we forgot to enable it for testing" will be my favorite excuse if it were to hit live servers bugged. Riot's idiotic policy could easily lead to a skin with game-breaking bugs to appear on live servers and damn near nobody would know in advance. That's complete BS.
Rioter Comments
: RP on PBE, it’s back!
One last attempt to get you guys to actually do something for our sake instead of your own interests. So when the RP system first broke, after a few months it became clear you guys were hoping it would blow over and you could just give us whatever you needed tested so you wouldn't need to pay people to do that. This did not happen. As was clear, the forums became flooded with threads complaining about the lack of RP and after around half a year of silence, we got this. A step in the right direction to be sure, but with the way the jinx skin was handled it's once again clear that you don't give a damn about our feedback. So as one final attempt to get you to give PBE players some kind of reward for helping **you** release updates for **your** game without them breaking it, Please just restore the shop so we can buy everything that's on live servers + the stuff from the next patch. I mean for fuck's sake Baker Pantheon can't be tested by people who didn't get it before last july because prior to us getting RP back, everything from May 2016 - feb 2019 was stripped from the shop. If the past year has been any indicator, this comment will probably fade away without getting a response from any rioters or PBE players. I mostly typed this out because I needed to know I made one last attempt to get the store fixed before I stopped trying.
: Mini rework on Kayle >.<
the true damage is being removed because it's impossible to balance. I mean seriously, I have no clue what they were smoking when they decided "herp derp let's give this champ aoe true damage with a strong AP and AD ratio on every auto attack as well as giving her a massive attack speed, this is a good idea" but I'm glad they removed it, who knows maybe she'll actually become strong but balanced instead of either being unfathomably broken or absolutely unplayable.
: Used to be you got your RP reset to 8000RP each day but apparently, in the "RP is back" sticky, they say that too much RP crashes the store. I don't really... buy that. It makes it sound like each RP is a process running on your computer when it should really just be a number in a secure database. 3000RP isn't even enough to grab a set of skins.
the 8000 RP giving system broke because of new security systems the introduced to all the servers to keep people's wallet info safe. If you want to complain about something, make it about a real fucking problem. I for one am glad to get only **1000** RP a day if it means that the store will be fixed so we can actually buy skins that were released between may 2016- feb 2019. Everything since the last wave of super galaxy skins is currently not available in the store but instead people are bitching about not having enough RP instead of the fact that shit is blocked off to us. Because nobody is bringing this up, Riot doesn't give a fuck about us being unable to purchase this stuff.
Rioter Comments
: No no no, I'm fine with them having chromas IF they actually changed their vfx. Also, Pyke is not the first legendary to have chromas
> [{quoted}](name=Bird Lad,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=sRkRJQEE,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-07-18T01:40:50.116+0000) > > No no no, I'm fine with them having chromas IF they actually changed their vfx. Also, Pyke is not the first legendary to have chromas What irks me is that when they did the papercraft line, it looked like they were going to start changing vfx to match the chroma colors...and then they just kind of didn't.
: > [{quoted}](name=EternalSerb024,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=3AEB3uHA,comment-id=002f00000000,timestamp=2019-03-22T23:10:53.290+0000) > > they used to do that but now it just seems like a stupid restriction. In addition to that, it creates a massive discrepancy between the PBE and live stores. You asked for a why, I gave the explanation D: They used to do that indeed, and haven't done it with the more recent skins. They just haven't "fixed" it with the older skins is all. It's up to debate whether they'll fix it, considering it's still old content and it still no longer needs any testing. I've learned that Riot should mess with the store as little as possible if we want to prevent the entire thing from going to hell. They could be available is mystery chests and the Hextech system though, so you can try your luck with that.
I did not ask for a why, someone else did, I simply responded with a criticism of the policy. That said, I am unsure on if they'll fix it, if the community demands it often enough (they won't, they're too busy bitching about how "waa waa it's not *enough* RP" D:) Riot might fix it but as is you're probably right about Riot not bothering with it. The only good reason I can think of that Riot might is because it creates an inconsistency between the two stores.
: > [{quoted}](name=pooooooooooom,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=3AEB3uHA,comment-id=002f,timestamp=2019-03-22T22:32:42.667+0000) > > Why most skins is limited I can not buy Riot disabled a lot of older content from store once it no longer needs testing.
they used to do that but now it just seems like a stupid restriction. In addition to that, it creates a massive discrepancy between the PBE and live stores.
: > [{quoted}](name=LL Hari,realm=PBE,application-id=AYQh7p7O,discussion-id=eXgV1yiu,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-21T18:24:23.172+0000) > > I think that's better but you know rito. I know that they could've just not gave us RP at all but you know the community, always ungrateful for what they get even when riot does listen to the community.
As someone who was previously extremely vocal in my complaints about the loss of RP and proposed solutions, I have to say I'm sick of people bitching about the RP. We have it now, it's a good amount jesus fucking christ.
: We try to keep store content consistent across Live and PBE to mitigate risks.
As happy as I am with the return of RP I do feel the need to point out that there are some skins that are only available for purchase on live, the cosmic line, the god-king skins, gun goddess MF, etc. Out of curiosity, are you guys planning on fixing this issue and if not, just tell us so we know.
Show more

EternalSerb024

Level 91 (PBE)
Lifetime Upvotes
Create a Discussion