: I am a bit disappointed that neither Aviator or Order of the Lotus got new particles, they had a lot of potential for new particles even if it was just a re-coloring of the base ones. Also, her face on the Order of the Lotus feels a bit weird for me, maybe it's the nose or something, but she doesn't look like the other splashes at all.
Her face seems very round in that splash art compared to a more narrow shape in her other ones, I think that's the issue. It's also a very soft feeling portrayed on her face compared to mostly determined on her other skins (although Aviator is very peppy looking now too).
: You can totally post that here too!
If that's the case, is there any reason that the hair color was changed on her Frostblade skin? The new purple color just looks really out of place with her old blue hair; I understand that it might make her more readable as Irelia and distinguish her from being a big blue smudge on screen but it just seems really odd to change that.
: PBE Bugs & Feedback Thread: Pulsefire Ezreal Update!
First thing I want to say is that his new animations are excellent. The Q doesn't feel nearly as...off? I guess I'd say as the current one does. Currently when you use his Q on live with Pulsefire it feels like nothing happens at the start and then the animation happens much faster than it should, while the new one feels much more like his other skins and base skin. The new animations in general are just super smooth and are much better representations of today's skin quality which shows just how far your artists and animators have come since the original Ultimate skin's release. Overall it feels a lot more like playing a traditional Ezreal skin (I stopped using Pulsefire and went back to Frosted because of the feeling of the skin) rather than a wonky Pulsefire Ezreal that has animations that just don't feel quite right.
: 7.5 cycle - Aatrox changes coming to the PBE
So I know this is going to sound odd, but were you trying to turn Aatrox into an assassin? Because it looks like you kinda made him one. The changes to his ratios aren't incredibly helpful to it, but the problem is the same thing it's been all season after its buff: Lethality. The ease with which you can itemize CDR into a Lethality build (Ghostblade, Black Cleaver) combined with the defensive stats available (MR on Edge of Night) is a potent combination, and charging Edge of Night before you Q onto a target all but guarantees that you'll land the Q knockup as long as you aimed it well. He becomes incredibly bursty with Lethality items since his E was changed to do physical damage instead of magic damage, and you're increasing the slow on an ability that can be maxed first for wave clear. He has wave clear and strong initiation as well as a self revive to counter other assassins! Aatrox top might not do very well with these changes, but Aatrox as an assassin or counter-assassin champion mid might actually have a ton of potential with these changes, even if it's terribly backwards from his class fantasy. Testing a build somewhere along the lines of {{item:3814}} {{item:3071}} {{item:3142}} {{item:3033}} {{item:3053}} and then boots was looking fairly promising. The Edge of Night allows him initiation without being CC'd or stopped and his Q>E>WAuto with Thunderlords and Lethality actually has some pretty insane burst. On top of that, he's an assassin that could contribute to initiation and team fighting. Edge of Night again guarantees your initiation and Sterak's Gage prevents burst killing you which basically guarantees you fill your Blood Well which guarantees resurrection in the chance of your premature demise. Ghostblade lets him stick to targets well, especially when combined with the increased slow on later ranks of his E, and he still does decent sustained damage with his attack speed steroid on ultimate and passive as well as the W damage being physical, making the Lethality build keep your sustained damage up as well. I think that, at least with the current changes here, his jungle clear is severely diminished and his top lane will remain about neutral but you provided an excellent platform for mid lane Aatrox to succeed as a initiator assassin similar to Fizz, and especially as a counter to other assassins because of his revive passive. He'd make an excellent counter to Zed or Talon as long as you were able to stack your passive.
: Update on Sewn Chaos
If you're looking for alternative ideas to represent those champions, that's tough because they've both got a pretty wide variety right now. The one thing I would like to see is a Battlecast Prototype Blitzcrank. Since Viktor is Blitzcrank's creator in the lore (at least previously, not so sure what it is now) it would only make sense that the Creator's first invention should have a skin relating to his glorious evolution, but I feel like it might possibly infringe a little bit on the iBlitzcrank skin he currently has with the more high-tech animations and particles he would need. For Amumu I'd love to see a Blood Moon skin actually, although this wouldn't be rolled out until next year. I think his circular animations would be perfect for this skin line's animations, although it may have too much overlap with Kennen in the Q/R abilities. Barring that one, a new Omega Squad skin! Amumu is the perfect champion to make a dark, brooding Omega Squad skin for; instead of looking for friends, he could simply refer to all his friends dying. Bandage Toss as a grappling hook, Despair as some sort of toxic gas, his Tantrum as some sort of flailing knife attack, and his Curse of the Sad Mummy having a razor wire fence on the rim of it. I mean we have Teemo right now, and it's a pretty unique skin line that hasn't been touched since the original, and I think Amumu would be the perfect addition to it. [Edit] I think for an Omega Squad Amumu skin, he'd probably need a significant Visual Update to have it done right though.
: We purposefully de-coupled URF from April Fools last year to try to create a new tradition that we thought would be fun :) Unfortunately, it didn't work out as well as we'd have hoped. And we did release URF a few days after April Fools, because we knew it would suck if people didn't get to play it around that time. So it wasn't **on** April Fools, but it was very very shortly after. Also PS, people are looking into the reroll issues. :D Hopefully they will be fixed next patch!
Thank goodness. The losing rerolls on dodges thing is getting out of hand and makes me want to wait til the last second to reroll, but that can cause issues with the team's plans or overall strategy at the last second so it's frustrating no matter how I do it.
: Shyv can still abuse her clear speed to counterjungle, luckily. I played her earlier and it wasn't _too_ bad. She has bigger issues, like getting kited into oblivion with every single enemy champ having a slow now (seriously slows are far too abundant atm). That said, Yi gets hit really hard. TBH all of these champs need changes or buffs anyway, so it's not a bad time too look at them.
True, but it seems like jungle changes like this would have gone along much better with a rework of the fighter class instead of assassins. Like I said, Shyvana isn't punished quite as badly, but champions like Xin and Yi are going to be heavily impaired by these changes and there aren't any changes in sight for them right now which is somewhat scary for people who like to play them (I can hear Cowsep yelling from here). And even Shyvana is still going to feel an impact from this, especially with less ability to clear wards out from the removal of the raptor smite buff. It's going to bring her ganking potential from "outplay around vision" to "hope my enemy is stupid".
: Power farming junglers are something that we're suppressing as we've never really been happy with the gameplay of continuously power-farming your jungle until you come out fully farmed at 20 minutes. This isn't a line we intend to support. In general, the full clear will give more gold and xp than before - but not enough to match the continuous power-farming era.
> [{quoted}](name=Xypherous,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=iLMv2kLV,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2016-10-20T04:31:02.549+0000) > > Power farming junglers are something that we're suppressing as we've never really been happy with the gameplay of continuously power-farming your jungle until you come out fully farmed at 20 minutes. > > This isn't a line we intend to support. > > In general, the full clear will give more gold and xp than before - but not enough to match the continuous power-farming era. If this is the case, are we going to see significant changes to junglers that require heavy farm to contribute to their teams? Master Yi, Xin Zhao, and Shyvana to an extent are all going to be heavily affected by this change because their primary strength is strong jungle clearing at a high pace to make up for their lack of ganking power. While Xin may have some, Shyvana and Yi basically become worthless champions with this change.
: For Fiddlesticks I essentially see a nerf to his fear, MR reduction aura removal and forced interval between drains in exchange for a slight buff to his ability to position better once he ults. While the changes that might be considered buffs are nice to players unfamiliar with Fiddlesticks, as an experienced player of the champion I feel like experienced players don't benefit from this change nearly as much as they have already adapted their style to playing around timing WHEN to ult. As a former Fiddlesticks main I feel like my ult positioning should be about MY innate timing (...something something "separates the good Fiddlesticks from the great"). I feel like I'm essentially losing damage and CC output in exchange for positioning tools which experienced Fiddlesticks players, honestly, don't need as much.
> [{quoted}](name=emadbaig91,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=4grOkEhn,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-04-20T00:06:32.768+0000) > > For Fiddlesticks I essentially see a nerf to his fear, MR reduction aura removal and forced interval between drains in exchange for a slight buff to his ability to position better once he ults. > > While the changes that might be considered buffs are nice to players unfamiliar with Fiddlesticks, as an experienced player of the champion I feel like players don't benefit from this change nearly as much as they have already adapted their style to playing around timing WHEN to ult. > > As a former Fiddlesticks main I feel like my ult positioning should be about MY innate timing (...something something "separates the good Fiddlesticks from the great"). I feel like I'm essentially losing damage and CC output in exchange for positioning tools which experienced Fiddlesticks players, honestly, don't need as much. Basically this, sums the changes up perfectly. Fiddle is going to see a nerf to his CC both in the range on his fear and the fact that his silence will now jump to targets that haven't been hit (or, as I read it, jump to that nearby minion wave and get wasted) are both huge CC nerfs. He's losing damage based on losing his previous passive (which, don't get me wrong, was a very "hidden power" type of thing) and he's not going to be able to chain Drains any more for taking objectives like dragon in the early game. Honestly, the only actual thing he gains from this is the "on the way" ping from using his ultimate to communicate with his team better, and other than that it looks like extreme nerfs unless he's being given damage somewhere in the kit as well.
: Can you provide me anything more specific on what you would consider unique item support? From my point of view, Rylai's and Torment already favor DoT mages more so than most - while things like Thunderlord's also seem prime to be much better on DoT champions - so I'm likely missing something here about what type of support you're looking for. > Is the new Catalyst still going to be a component of Righteous Glory? If so, how are the stats of that item going to be affected (if at all) and are you concerned that junglers will start using Catalyst in the early game in place of Hunter's Potion for the champions that favor it so that they could pick up a Righteous Glory later? Catalyst is a component of Righteous Glory, and yes, it does give Tanks the ability to spec into Catalyst's cyclical sustain. It's important to note that this version of Catalyst is actually a far weaker sustain tool early than Catalyst's level up heal so I'm not sure that the jungle worry is entirely spot on. What this Catalyst does is scale into the later parts of the game and be a nice little boost for extended encounters.
> Can you provide me anything more specific on what you would consider unique item support? >From my point of view, Rylai's and Torment already favor DoT mages more so than most - while things like Thunderlord's also seem prime to be much better on DoT champions - so I'm likely missing something here about what type of support you're looking for. I was just curious if we were going to see any sort of items where the active or passive ability is specifically related to DoT abilities, other than the effect being tweaked by it like Liandry's getting reduced duration per tick type things. It'd be interesting to have some more build diversity other than rush Rylai's/Liandry's combo because of their interactions with each other on all of the current DoT mages like Swain and Malzahar. *[Edit] For example, an item where, when activated, made your next damage over time ability do all of its damage instantly, or an item that "hasted" your DoT abilities by making them tick twice as fast, things like that.* With only one item for them, I could definitely see it just being another "must have" item on them, so without multiple items and diverse effects provided I think it'd be difficult to do, so maybe something more for a future update rather than the more "quick tuning" in this one. This was more of a hypothetical "Do you think we'll ever see items like this?" over a "We should be getting one right now!" type question. > Catalyst is a component of Righteous Glory, and yes, it does give Tanks the ability to spec into Catalyst's cyclical sustain. It's important to note that this version of Catalyst is actually a far weaker sustain tool early than Catalyst's level up heal so I'm not sure that the jungle worry is entirely spot on. What this Catalyst does is scale into the later parts of the game and be a nice little boost for extended encounters. I'm just a little concerned for the safety of Hunter's Potion as an item in general. It's already a weak option for a lot of champions, and I don't want the few who may use it to all just shift over to Catalyst because it builds into a beneficial item later while the potion does not. I'm more worried about this on champions who aren't currently building Righteous Glory very often because of the leveling requirement for sustain, but who might potentially make great use of the new one when combined with blue buff like Udyr where he could just be gaining health back while walking around looking for ganks and using Bear Stance or get large amounts of mana back by soaking things with his Turtle Stance shield, things like that. I suppose the mana > health conversion would help on one side, I'm just trying to think of potential abusers to make sure the item turns out great! I'm also a little worried about champions with heals who might double dip with sustain on this item like Alistar who takes poke in lane and gets mana back and then double sustains by using his E. I suppose I'll really just have to wait and try it out, and hopefully it all feels okay on them.
: [Planned - 6.9] Mana x MP/5 x AP x MR Item Pass [Updated - 4/11/2016]
@Xypherous: Are we ever going to get unique item support for DoT related champions like Swain, Malzahar, or even Brand? It's a spot we're severely lacking, and I'd be interested to see an item that would provide some sort of benefit to damage over time spells that would give us room for more champions like them in the future! **[Edit]** After some further reading, thoughts, and taking a peek at the list of champions and thinking about just how many champions have DoT effects....the item(s) could even include damag*ing* over time abilities, like Tibbers' AoE aura, or synergy with Liandry's Torment. This could be extended to things like Amumu or Sejuani's W abilities, Rammus or Anivia's ultimates, or even things like Zyra plants and Singed/Teemo/Cass poisons. Item support for damage over time type abilities is not only lacking, but most of these abilities are penalized with current items because of the strength inherent in them, but it seems like most items are trying to push mages into one of three groups: sustained DPS (new Catalyst and its' upgrades), burst DPS (new gap closing item for bursty mages like Annie/Leblanc), or utility mages (new Athene's on champions like Orianna/Lux with a new kiting item that, as far as we know, isn't exclusive with Frost Queen's Claim). While I suppose you could lump DoT style mages in one of the categories there by champion (for example, label Cass as more bursty because of her ultimate, or Malz as a sustained DPS mage because of his DoT pushing) there really should be some sort of itemization support for these other champions as well. **[Another concern]** Is the new Catalyst still going to be a component of Righteous Glory? If so, how are the stats of that item going to be affected (if at all) and are you concerned that junglers will start using Catalyst in the early game in place of Hunter's Potion for the champions that favor it so that they could pick up a Righteous Glory later? While I'm not necessarily opposed to this, it seems like a lot of individual champions (Udyr, Maokai, and a few others) will need some heavy hits to their jungle sustainability if this item is still in the build path.
: > I'm just concerned about how this will actually play out for some of the very niche junglers who depend on leashing mobs back and forth with DoTs (Brand) to avoid damage or for champions with movement abilities (Quinn) that may be put into an awkward or even unplayable position because of these changes. Part of the reason we can't really support these characters in the current Jungle is that most of the edge-cases that allow them to Jungle rely on almost bug like interactions (that can change at a moment's notice.. when we fix bugs.) In the short term, this might make some junglers impossible but these rules at least apply a more uniform set of rules that all Junglers can be tuned around. I also work in like, a 6 month time lag from you guys - so most of the things I do incur short term costs because I'm also planning around for how future content will affect them. > From what I can see in the pictures, it looks like the entire camp hinges off the large monster in the camp, which is also a bit alarming for the occasional Alistar jungle game where I'll use Headbutt to throw the large Krug or large wolf over a wall to reduce the damage taken while I kill the smaller minions in the camp slowly; is this going to affect these types of things, or am I just worrying for nothing and the rules are staying relatively the same? I'm only displaying it on the large monsters right now as this is an ad-hoc visual solution (bars on every monster was really reeeaaaallly noisy) Depending on how much we like this solution and the effects on the game - we'll figure out some kind of better display system. Each monster has their own individual frustration - so you don't need to worry about the Alistar case.
Awesome, glad to at least get a response. I know it's difficult to support these alternate roles and keep things balanced (constant Lulu/Ezreal or item balancing because of these things) so I just wanted to get an idea a little ahead of time, but I'll be attempting them with the new mechanics in the jungle and seeing how it goes anyways. Also glad to see that each monster has it's own "patience" meter. This leaves some champions like Alistar able to jungle effectively, and also prevents fringe cases of abuse like Blitzcrank hooking the large creep to reset entire camps.
: [PBE - 5.19] Adjustment to Leashing Rules
Images broken for me as well. Being someone who primarily focuses on the jungle, I'm glad to see that there's some sort of set mechanic being put into place for this to help bot laners or mid laners kill the camps they want. I'm just concerned about how this will actually play out for some of the _very_ niche junglers who depend on leashing mobs back and forth with DoTs (Brand) to avoid damage or for champions with movement abilities (Quinn) that may be put into an awkward or even unplayable position because of these changes. From what I can see in the pictures, it looks like the entire camp hinges off the large monster in the camp, which is also a bit alarming for the occasional Alistar jungle game where I'll use Headbutt to throw the large Krug or large wolf over a wall to reduce the damage taken while I kill the smaller minions in the camp slowly; is this going to affect these types of things, or am I just worrying for nothing and the rules are staying relatively the same?
Rioter Comments
: [5.13] Core AP Items Pass
@Xypherous: Is there any plan to tweak Viktor's Augments at the moment because of these changes, because of the possibility of giving him too much AP with the buffed Deathcap percentage bonus? I mean, 5% doesn't sound like a ton, but it could be something worth looking into as a "just in case" measure.
: Play with friends and earn bonus IP with Party Rewards!
Another question in addition to the one I addressed to Lyte; would this multiply your win of the day bonus, or just the typical game IP? Would be a large spike of players grouping for their first game of the day before moving on to solo queue, which could brighten moods and potentially create a more positive and teamwork oriented playstyle in the later solo games.
: The numbers aren't final, as we'll be testing a few iterations on the PBE; however, currently the jackpots are 16x bonuses. They are huge :)
Is there a way to potentially tie in higher rates for positive players as incentive for more positive play? Positive players have an X% higher chance to get the higher bonuses, etc? Would be a nice way to reward positive play and not the premades who talk smack and are incredibly rude to the random players they may be matched with or against. I'm curious about your thoughts on something like this as an indirect bonus for the positive players in the community while not necessarily something that would be exclusive or an RP reward.
: Ability Bar and Buff Update - Feedback Thread
I think it's an okay idea, but I'm testing Skarner right now and having his Q stacks on the far side of the screen as a temporary buff that is very impactful to his gameplay is somewhat difficult to track, especially when chasing while low on mana and trying to just keep your stacks up by using a Q every now and then.
: PBE Bugs & Feedback Thread: Battlecast Alpha Skarner!
I'll be honest, I really like the looks of it so far. However, I'm also very disappointed that after literally years and even a rework worth of time spent waiting, Skarner's first post-release skin is a legendary skin and that he wasn't shown any kind of love before this. Will I buy it? Most likely. Will I be happy about the fact that his only post-release is a legendary? Not particularly. [Edit] So after getting on the PBE and testing it out now, a few things. His little lean forward to use his tail to attack for his crit animation looks a little odd; the animation is so fast it looks like he's tipping over when he shoves his back end overhead to attack with his tail. Buffs are **very** difficult to see on him. When I have a blue/red buff, I can barely see the buff on me, and combined with moving the buffs to the character portrait instead of above your ability bar, it can be difficult to check if you have your buffs still or even when your Q is stacked because you're constantly looking *away* from the action to check your buffs, which can be *very* detrimental to champions in general, but especially to champions like Skarner who have a couple different buffs to maintain while fighting and may need to have these buffs visible while low on mana to maintain the attack speed buff while chasing. In addition, his passive stacks are very hard to see on the new Summoner's Rift because of the muted color palette being used; the dark red color is difficult to see in some areas of the map, especially on the Baron side of the map where the ground is brown in some areas.
: [Udyr] - Loaded Dice Bug
This occurs with any champion right now; the Loaded Dice icon/tooltip are just placeholder right now.
Rioter Comments
: Central Feedback Thread for Viktor Gameplay Update
I'm fairly familiar with Viktor; I've got a few ranked games on him, I do fairly well with him when I play him in solo queue, and I enjoy messing around with him in normals and using silly bruiser builds that go Q Augment and Furor boots for funsies. As for the questions posted: 1: His *abilities feel about the same overall as they used to, although the instant shielding on his Q is absolutely amazing*. Like, I cannot state how important this is to making him a more viable mage. It's absolutely astounding how much of a difference it makes, even when I was just testing against a bot in a custom game. 2: Honestly,* I think augmenting his Q first is the way to go now, followed by E and then W*. The Q augment will allow for better trading in lane with the movement speed and his new instant shields and autoattack buff; the augment last long enough to run up, pop the auto into your opponent, and still have some time to back out. The augmented E was nice and all, although visually I think it could use a little pop. It gives the impression of being very weak from the visual effect, which seems a bit misleading. The first two (Q and E) seemed like good ones to rush, Q for lane trading and mobility and the E for wave clearing. I saved the W (and thus final augment) for after Lichbane and Sorcs were finished. 3: I *definitely noticed a difference in the initial cast time*, even if it's only the smallest of differences. It just feels like it drops much faster, but the movements looked sorta janky when I was trying to move it around. 4: *The Siphon Power'd auto seems fairly good*. I definitely like the fact that it was hitting towers; it allows him to have some real tower pushing presence in the game where the more common mids these days are either AD champions (tower pushing fiends) or champions like Ziggs who do well with Lichbane and have other effects (Ziggs passive for example) that let him push very well, while still having decent wave clear. *The one thing I will say though; I'm afraid it may actually be too strong for tower pushing with such a short cooldown*. It might be something worth looking into if he proves to be too strong; his dueling power and overall strength seem very good now; I think this will take him from a champion very rarely seen to a champion who will see a **lot** of play. 5: *I didn't really feel a noticeable spike throughout the game*; it felt like he ramped up very smoothly overall, but this is probably because I tried maxing the changed Q first and that scales with level, as well as his Hex Core and upgrades scaling with level. He seemed very smooth as he leveled up, but I have a feeling that this could be an issue if he starts to fall behind in lane due to a couple ganks or deaths. That's *my one main concern; with his leveling being such an important factor, I have a feeling that people will try to set him back a level or two with ganks and then he won't really scale back up very well* until it's far too late for him to contribute to the game when he catches up in levels.
: Ascension Bug Report Thread
I was playing Warwick against an enemy Kha'zix and we were fighting alongside some teammates to kill the Xerath. My teammate got the ascension buff and went into the little delay and heal, and during this period I was considered isolated for the Kha'zix while literally standing on top of a teammate because they were in the ascension buff.
: Do Azir's turrets grant gold on destruction?
Last time I checked, they were granting similar gold to the outermost towers in game, but it was a 1v1 so not sure if the gold is spread or personal, etc. But they do grant some gold.
Rioter Comments
: Distortion Boots Increased Cooldown On Teleport
Just to be 100% sure, you did use Teleport to a tower both times correct? Teleport only gets the 200 second cooldown if you use it to a tower. If you used it on a ward or a minion, it should get the 240 second cooldown and to a tower should give it a 160 second cooldown.
Rioter Comments
: I think the most significant problem we have here is that the Flurry Attack Speed buff is really hard to understand on paper, making the changes as a whole feel like we are sapping the life from Lee. Let’s approach the problem numerically first: Assume Lee Sin builds the most common bruiser/assassin build (which is AD/Armor Pen/tankiness etc. – items which support a pattern of quickly accessing the backline and surviving for a bit once there) in a game and he hits lv16. The PBE Lee Sin will have is 100%(his base AS)+45%(3% per level and he leveled up 15 times) +100%(new flurry)=245%(of original AS). Meanwhile, the Live Flurry values will leave Lee with 100%+45%+40%=185% of original AS. The difference here results in a 32.4% sustain damage increase from basic attacks if Lee can manage his passive in an ideal way. With so much more sustain damage, Lee Sin provides a higher damage threat to enemies after the first few seconds, without having to burst them as hard in the first one or two. It also means a 32.4% improved basic attack frame – landing auto attacks in between spells will be more feasible and more rewarding. I think your simulation of Lee Sin in a late game team fight is based on the fact that the Live version of Lee Sin is really weak at that point. Considering all the tools he has, why is that, and how does it happen? In a world where Lee Sin can deal meaningful sustained damage at all points in the game, you no longer are relegated to just looking for an ideal initiation and then having 80% of your job done. He can still have that meaningful initiation power, but the power it brings becomes largely about positioning, and less about the burst. After this point, he can use his increased sustain damage to remain a legitimate threat to the enemy team. Dragon’s Rage specifically is a really cool spell that provides a ton of fun gameplay, but as mentioned above, we really want to separate its use as utility versus damage. The current proposed Dragon’s Rage does approximately 50/55/60% damage compared to the Live version on cast, but it is increased by 50% for each enemy the target collides with. Under this paradigm, if you manage to kick your target into two enemy champions, it’s about same damage. If you manage to kick your target through his whole team, however, you will get a very noticeable damage reward (750 + 3.0 Total AD), resulting in massive damage to the original target. It’s definitely cool to Insec kick a high-profile enemy into your team, but the cool thing about that play specifically really isn't the damage you dealt; it’s the displacement utility you brought to your team. And while that play is cool, it has come to overshadow other uses of the ability in team fights. We want to reward players for thinking about the direction in which they kick their target. As far as the 1v1 case is concerned, Dragon’s Rage will deal 100ish less damage. This is absolutely significant, but the increased sustained threat from Flurry should be enough to compensate for that after the first few seconds.
I'll save my judgement for it when it hits the PBE, but the in-game practicality of being able to maximize the potential of that passive is highly unlikely. The problem is that 9 times out of 10 you're already wasting a couple of them to get to your target and slow them down; you're either burning your Q or W to get to the target and then using your E to slow them down so you can stick to them. Without either higher movement speed than the target or a Phage/Triforce/Mallet you have trouble sticking to most targets without using your Cripple almost immediately right now because of the popularity of high mobility champions (popular ADCs being Cait/Lucian [dashes] and Sivir [spellshield], popular mids being LeBlanc [2 dashes], Gragas, Ziggs [minefields and satchel charges], top laners such as Renekton [double dash], or Shyvana and Mundo [run speed and slow in Mundo's case].) I'm also concerned with how this will affect his early jungle clears and speed as well; lowered early game damage combined with his Tempest now being physical damage concerns me for his pre-6 jungling, at the period where his passive has not scaled up to the next level yet; he's going to see a reduced clear time and a less sustained jungle clear, leaving him more vulnerable in the early game to the likes of popular champions with a strong early game like Vi, Kha'zix, Elise, and the recently resurging Evelynn. With his Tempest doing physical damage it's also going to do even LESS damage to the jungle creeps who have next to zero MR in the early game but do have some armor. It's a double dipping nerf to his E, which is going to greatly diminish his jungling ability; with these changes you're unlikely to see him played as a jungler much longer because he won't have the early game burst that he used to have in ganks, a more restrictive energy cost on his Safeguard, and his slow is going to be weaker; he's essentially going to be restricted to top lane as another one of the tanky bruisers.
: What damage reduction you are talking about? If Tempest at champion level 4 is at level 1 and you got AD runes and 9/21/0 masteries without any other damage item, you actually deal the same damage. Same for ulti, if you hit 2 things with it it actually deals more damage, and that also counts enemy minions. If you max Q first, you actually got near to no nerfs earlygame while having a way stronger late. Because if you max Q first, it only deals 5-10 damage less until it is maxed, after that, it already deals more damage.
This is where you go back and read that I generally play Lee as a top laner, using masteries along the lines of 22/5/3. Tempest is going to be doing reduced damage because people generally have more armor than they do magic resist; even if they left the numbers exactly the same as they are on live, you would deal less damage because of the abundance of armor items and their low costs. A Warden's Mail is only 1000 gold, you can start with a Cloth Armor against Lee Sin and counter all 3 of his damaging abilities now, and on your first back you've effectively made yourself almost untouchable to him because the buff they've tried to throw in to counteract this is actually countered by the same item's AS slow. As for the ultimate, in early game fights (see: laning) you would have to knock the target through three enemies to even break even on the damage of his previous ultimate. This is assuming AD Reds/Quints and offensive masteries, without taking into account any damage items which would actually make this worse; a Doran's Blade start would give ~9 damage to your ultimate in the new plan compared to ~16 damage to your old ultimate with the bonus AD scaling. You're going to see a much easier to counter champion once he's purely physical damage on his abilities, which will almost force him to go for early Last Whisper as a core item if he wants to see this "late game scaling", but the changes have transitioned him to be a sustained bruiser instead of a burst caster, so the odds of being able to build said Last Whisper are fairly low since you're almost forced to build tanky instead of building damage now. Meanwhile, the reign of Renekton still stands as one of the best top lane champions in the game with an incredibly abusive early game and a transition into a giant meatshield late game.
: Let's talk about Lee Sin retune
This whole thing concerns me to be honest. While I understand the need to tone down his early game (I play quite a lot of Lee, I understand it!) I think the AS buff on his passive being his scaling factor into late game is just going to be negligible. When team fights begin later in the game, you don't get the chance to take advantage of your passive very often honestly. You generally start out by landing a Q and following it in, ward or minion hopping behind a target, and ulting them back into your team for a successful initiation. You've now used 3 of your 4 abilities and have not been able to take advantage of your passive in any way. Now perhaps after this you can land an auto or two, assuming you aren't CC chained by the opposing team collapsing on you after you kick someone out of their team, and then you use your Tempest, which you'll generally want to follow up with Cripple almost immediately to reduce the incoming damage with the AS slow. You don't really get the chance to use your passive in between this, so you generally only get to use the second of the two passive procs here. So you've used every ability, you're probably close to out of energy, and you've used 2 of your potential 7 passives in this fight. I think the issue is that you're trying to take a burst caster and turn him into a sustained damage champion, which is the exact opposite of what he is right now. * A Lee Sin using AD reds/quints and offensive masteries has 149.52 AD at level 18, or 150 with rounding. Flat Q damage, with no items involved, is going to be ~460 without taking the percent damage increase into account. This is going to be around a ~60 damage increase without taking items into account at all. A net buff to his Q overall, although it will definitely be weaker early game. I think this one looks okay as long as it doesn't get any other massive changes (cooldown increase, other damage nerfs, etc). * Safeguard change is quite painful but at least understandable. Making him trade something for jumping to wards is okay, makes sense. The thing that needs to be taken into account when comparing him to champions like Jax or Katarina is that neither of them use any form of skillshot for their damage and Katarina has no costs at all and gains a damage reduction buff for using hers. * Tempest is the change that bothers me the most. While it may be a bit odd, I used Lee Sin as a counter to armor stacking champions such as Malphite purely based on the fact that Tempest did magic damage instead of physical. I understand the change to physical damage, it makes sense. It was hard for the opponent to read and it could be confusing when you built armor in lane to counter that guy building AD...and then got wrecked anyways. However, I think the damage nerfs on top of this change might be a bit too much; keep in mind that the damage will now already be reduced by armor, making it A) easier to counter Lee Sin in lane and B) already reduce Tempest's damage due to the availability of great armor items (Randuin's Omen, Sunfire Cape, Thornmail [situational], Ninja Tabi) before it sees the damage nerfs as well. It also completely destroys building AD on Lee Sin; instead of going Brutalizer into LW ala Zed/Talon and playing him as any form of assassin (I've even done this in the jungle after Lizard Elder when I get massively ahead) it now pretty much pigeonholes him into the generic bruiser build of Armor item > MR item > some random damage item (Hydra, BoRK, Triforce) and then call it a day and stack some health. * The ultimate change greatly concerns me since I tend to play a lot of Lee Sin top to counter champions like Jax and Wukong, or tanks like Mundo/Shyvana/Malphite in some cases. His ultimate in 1v1 situations is going to be about as useful as Skarner using his ultimate in a 1v1. As in, you move them a little bit. The damage has absolutely been shattered in anything but the most perfect use into the middle of the enemy team which sort of defeats the purpose of a movement displacing ability. Just my thoughts, character limit D:
: There could be a Script that, unlocks the Surrender option. Something like this: Farming count of one team is 300 points ahead/behind Kill count has a difference of 20. Baron kills exceed the count of 5 (rly?). I'd totally agree with some sort of system like that. It seems kinda bad since it unlocks so easy, yet it's still a democracy. 3/5 needs to vote in favor or no deal. About the Baron kills rule, it seems lame right? But lets do the math, if you actually do a Ranked game and for some reason your team kills Baron 5 times... that's a 48'ish minutes game... Sort of hard since ranked games tend to be rushed to win right? Yet a fair rule since 1 Baron kill is already a big advantage and can turn out games into another direction... Thus making 5 Baron kills to the same team a really unappreciated experience plus I doubt it can happen unless the Baron-Slayer-Team is trolling hard.
The thing about the "5 Barons" is that Baron doesn't spawn until the 15 minute mark; after the second Baron is taken, even if one team gets it the second it spawns, it's at the 22 minute mark because of his 7 minute respawn timer. Anything past a single Baron exceeds 20 minutes, so your team would already be able to surrender.
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