: Some questioning about new masteries amplifying the ranged top problem.
Double Edged Sword: Interesting point. Maybe leave it as 5% damage increase for both melee and ranged, but tweak the damage taken numbers more? E.g. 2% taken, 3% taken. I do feel like Battle Trance could be more effective on melee champs, since you only need to be in combat for 2.5 seconds before you hit breakeven on the (damage done)/(damage taken) ratio. Since it starts ticking when you take damage and combats 5 seconds, waiting a few seconds and then engaging lets you get 5% bonus damage with no drawback? Haven't tested it myself yet though, mostly been testing supports w/ Resolve/Cunning builds. Fervor of Battle: Yeah, looks like they're trying to remove how much damage it adds on people who don't build for damage. % Base AD is an interesting idea, but don't think the scaling needs to be that sharp. .75% base AD at level 1 is less than .5 damage on a lot of people. Given that base AD scales with level anyway, wouldn't just 2% base AD/stack work just fine? On the other hand, fighters generally rely on their abilities for damage the entire game, while carries (with some exception) start devaluing it as their crit/AS scaling starts to turn on. Given that fighters commonly have AD ratios above 1.0, I'm not willing to categorically state it's worse on fighters yet (Darius in particular. Dude has a ton of AD ratios). Tanks? Yeah, straight up nerf.
: Courage of the Colossus needs to be toned down significantly, both the base value and the %hp value. 10% for _every nearby champion_ is just ridiculous, especially with built-in resistances ramping that effective hp to sky-high levels. It's not uncommon to see a Braum or Alistar to stun someone and suddenly have a shield that takes up 30% of their health bar at any stage of the game. And it lasts too long, so you can't even stall it out before they get away/manage to run you down.
7%, for what it's worth. And I honestly do believe that Fearless (Resolve t4) is contributing to the perception of how tanky it seems people are when Courage activates. Sure, it's only 4-5 armor/MR early, but easily 40+ late off nothing more than base stats. A free Chain Vest + Negatron, even for only 2 seconds, is not to be sneezed at.
: [Twitch] - Stormraider's Surge in Brush
This seems to be the temporary buff icon for Greenfather's Gift, the new tier 4 Cunning mastery. Refreshes constantly in brush only, expires over 3 seconds if you leave, and goes on 9 second cooldown after attacking or using a spell on anything. Accompanied by a greenish glow like a Sheen proc buff, and should see the different colored number for magic damage by damaging something. Does this match what you've been seeing?
Rioter Comments
: Managed to get a few more games on Alistar this morning before the servers went down for maintenance. Will be interested to see how the rest of the system changes going live change how he plays. Previous feedback for reference: http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/VPMXKrb7-alistar-changes-feedback **1. Windspeaker's:** Impression from playing with it this morning is significantly better than expected. Relic Shield charges plus minions and cc in lane work often enough it doesn't feel bad, and the kill/assist trigger makes it okay (or not worthless) in bigger fights. Suspect Bond of Stone could be better for helping teammates/adc, especially w/ Knight's Vow. It's at least somewhat plausible that Ali has the choice of 4 keystones come live, which is staggering. **2. Shorter Knockup:** I wondering what felt funny, here it is. Definite nerf, but that's the cost of improving other things. **3. Early All-in Potential:** See point 2. Not having access to the longer CC at lvl 2 hurts, as does losing the damage from old passive. On the other hand, you get a pretty significant amount of healing out of passive in exchange. Minimum 40 for adc, likely to add an extra 54-108 on top of that from clearing minions plus having it go when you start the fight. Helps a ton in keeping the fight a 1 for 0 instead of trading kills as well. **4. Trample:** The more I've played with this, the more I like it. People are scared of staying near you after you combo, which feels so much better than going in and then feeling useless. "Don't mind me, just going to block skillshots and try and auto people" has turned into "Stick to them, stay in their face, land the stun." Big, BIG thematic win in my opinion. Rylai's is fun, but you're probably going to need someone else's slow or CC to make it stick. Cait+Ali is better than ever. **5. Unbreakable:** Still the same defensive buff as always.... and yet feels worse than before. Minor quibble, as the bonus AD has been hard to appreciate and/or recognize for ally or enemy except at pretty high levels of play. And honestly, I'll take this Alistar over live Ali in a heartbeat. An initial thought to fix that is to add some interaction between E and R, but it seems hard to find something that doesn't dramatically increase power. Adding more duration on E (auto E for duration of ult, E refreshed for duration, etc.) means enemies have to stay away from him for much longer, and lets Ali catch up and stun people anyway. Maybe trigger Triumphant when it expires? That way passive triggers more evenly between fights where Ali does well and those where he doesn't. Probably have more feedback tomorrow, going to try and squeeze out Diamond 5 this season.
Placeholder for more feedback. Colossus seems really strong numbers wise. 30+14% max health shield for the level 2 all in definitely alleviates concern about getting poked out, but need to check in game. Thunderlord's for burst, Windspeaker for sustaining others, Colossus for personal survival, Bond of stone for...?
: the cooldown begins after the stealth, always been that way giving more reason to rank an ability should be fine, having more reason to point points into W attack damage gets amped by his E and critical strikes, so % max health physical damage on-hit is LESS damage than what it does currently, not more
Q: Yes, I know. 14s camo at max rank followed currently by 16s, your suggestion 10s instead. The idea is that it's you can deny Twitch his flank, he's missing his AS steroid and escape for quite a while. W: more incentive to rank != Enough to rank first. Compare to AS steroid and camo duration, or pure damage on E. R: it's more damage. On average, lvl 6 ADs have~800 HP, which gives him 40 bonus dmg, also not reduced from hitting multiple targets. That's twice as effective as current, very easy to give up the extra E damage. It's 60 bonus damage against tank supports like Alistar, who could have 1200 hp at that point. Most importantly, still doesn't explain why an ADC with tools to damage squishy targets needs something to let him deal more damage to tanks.
: [Early 10/20] Twitch Balance Suggestions
Doesn't make much sense. Q: Camouflage is standard across the several champs that use it (Rengar, Eve, Twitch) and so likely won't be changed. Decreasing the CD on it makes his Camo uptime really high, probably not a good idea. W: Not sure on this one. Tweaks his power curve, and basically an overall nerf. He's not going to want to rank this more than once until 13 anyway, and 70 % vs 60% matters a lot less than 30% vs 40%. R: No, that's way too strong. That breaks even with the old one at 400/500/575 hp on the target for autos, and even squishy targets have approx. double that early, and triple that late. Even counting that it can't crit, it's a damage boost on squishy targets, and even stronger versus tanks. Design-wise, Twitch doesn't need extra damage on tanks with his ult. Bonus range and pass through autos let him hit multiple targets, and he can use Q to flank and focus on squishies anyway.
: [6.22 Alistar changes] Context and feedback thread
Managed to get a few more games on Alistar this morning before the servers went down for maintenance. Will be interested to see how the rest of the system changes going live change how he plays. Previous feedback for reference: http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/VPMXKrb7-alistar-changes-feedback **1. Windspeaker's:** Impression from playing with it this morning is significantly better than expected. Relic Shield charges plus minions and cc in lane work often enough it doesn't feel bad, and the kill/assist trigger makes it okay (or not worthless) in bigger fights. Suspect Bond of Stone could be better for helping teammates/adc, especially w/ Knight's Vow. It's at least somewhat plausible that Ali has the choice of 4 keystones come live, which is staggering. **2. Shorter Knockup:** I wondering what felt funny, here it is. Definite nerf, but that's the cost of improving other things. **3. Early All-in Potential:** See point 2. Not having access to the longer CC at lvl 2 hurts, as does losing the damage from old passive. On the other hand, you get a pretty significant amount of healing out of passive in exchange. Minimum 40 for adc, likely to add an extra 54-108 on top of that from clearing minions plus having it go when you start the fight. Helps a ton in keeping the fight a 1 for 0 instead of trading kills as well. **4. Trample:** The more I've played with this, the more I like it. People are scared of staying near you after you combo, which feels so much better than going in and then feeling useless. "Don't mind me, just going to block skillshots and try and auto people" has turned into "Stick to them, stay in their face, land the stun." Big, BIG thematic win in my opinion. Rylai's is fun, but you're probably going to need someone else's slow or CC to make it stick. Cait+Ali is better than ever. **5. Unbreakable:** Still the same defensive buff as always.... and yet feels worse than before. Minor quibble, as the bonus AD has been hard to appreciate and/or recognize for ally or enemy except at pretty high levels of play. And honestly, I'll take this Alistar over live Ali in a heartbeat. An initial thought to fix that is to add some interaction between E and R, but it seems hard to find something that doesn't dramatically increase power. Adding more duration on E (auto E for duration of ult, E refreshed for duration, etc.) means enemies have to stay away from him for much longer, and lets Ali catch up and stun people anyway. Maybe trigger Triumphant when it expires? That way passive triggers more evenly between fights where Ali does well and those where he doesn't. Probably have more feedback tomorrow, going to try and squeeze out Diamond 5 this season.
: Can this changes work on large (E) and small (P) jungle monsters too or you simply don't want alistar to jungle at all?
Was just in game, passive does grant stacks on death of jungle monsters (large and small), and maybe wards as well. But yes, Riot's official position on Alistar jungle has been 1) they do not want it, and 2) will nerf as appropriate should it become anything other than marginal cheese.
: I found myself compelled to see what viable alternate builds there were for this new version. From the looks of it, Full AP Alistar continues to be hilarious on him, with the possibility of Liandry's and Rylai's appearing to take advantage of the AoE DoT aspect of the new Trample. As far as not so cheese builds, he can probably function with Juggernaut itemization. Just think of the Sheen proc on that Trample Punch.
Rylai's might actually be legit, at least as a luxury item. Constant AoE slow from Trample makes it a lot easier to get to 5 stacks, and really helps him with his peel.
: Thanks for playing him, I created a thread about the Alistar changes if you want to continue the discussion! [http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/un8LUXyg-622-alistar-changes-context-and-feedback-thread] Q also no longer stuns after the target lands so it was trading an extra AoE 0.5s for a single target 1s stun + additional damage (to compensate the damage loss from the ult).
> [{quoted}](name=Shin Kazuo,realm=PBE,application-id=2EAF660193FA3B668D7234B3AEBB530C5AB7F651,discussion-id=VPMXKrb7,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2016-10-19T02:45:49.932+0000) > > Thanks for playing him, I created a thread about the Alistar changes if you want to continue the discussion! > > [http://boards.pbe.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/champions-gameplay-feedback/un8LUXyg-622-alistar-changes-context-and-feedback-thread] > > Q also no longer stuns after the target lands so it was trading an extra AoE 0.5s for a single target 1s stun + additional damage (to compensate the damage loss from the ult). Sure, I'll be over there. Thanks for the official thread creation!
  Rioter Comments
: The "Control" ward
Feels good to me. It's like they made pink wards cheaper and let me carry 3, plus harder for them to contest ward fights.
: You do realize all these items upgrade and their gold generation increases as well right? I don't mean that in a smart-alecky kind of way, but in terms of theorycrafting we need more practical data to use. Hardly anyone just stays in lane for 10 mins of farming, that is the most passive bot lane I've ever heard of. Supports have to back when they run out of wards and that gives them the opportunity to upgrade their gold items and also ruins their ability to be generating the gold from whichever path they choose. Someone who picks philosopher or kages still gets gold when they have to leave lane vs executioner has no passive gp10. Executioner has the highest potential but it is also risky because you have to stay in lane to make good use of it. Not to mention final build item and play style's influence on your pick.
Yes, I do realize that the upgrades affect the gold generated, and agree that more practical data would be useful. On the other hand, skill levels in PBE matches are all over the place, making testing relative power level more than a bit of a crapshoot. Platinum solo-queue it is not. I'll grant that Philosopher's Pebble can have the lowest initial gold gain, since you can achieve optimum gold gain by afking in the bush. Optimum usage on Kage's is extraordinarily risky, since it draws minion aggro constantly at the point in the game where minions are strongest relative to champions and assumes you have the range advantage to not get wrecked by opposing champions in the process. Executioner's gives double Philosopher's gold for last hitting a single minion every wave along with giving you an easy tool to do it with, bonus health, and bonus health regen. As far as out of lane goes, both Kage's Lucky Pick and Philosopher's Stone give minimal gold when not in lane, since the majority of their income comes from minion deaths and being able to harass champions with attacks or spells, respectively. Mostly worried how much they pale in comparison to Executioner's early power.
: Keep in mind that the champions who utilize resource regeneration stats from Philosopher's pebble et al. don't always use it to harass. Soraka W, (half of) E, Janna E, Sona W, etc. are some of a variety of reasons you'd like mana regen over harass.
Kage's Pick gives the exact same amount of mana regen that Philosopher's Pebble does, while also giving AP to amplify the exact spells you quoted. I'm mostly concerned that the Philosopher's line gives significantly less gold than either Kage's or Executioner's in addition to providing less useful bonus stats.
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Atajo

Level 30 (PBE)
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