: Final update for 8.5. > Q can no longer be canceled. Thoughts: Removing the Q being cancellable. While it did a lot of good for the feelings of smoothness in Rengar's moment-to-moment pattern I in the end decided to revert the change for 2 key reasons: 1) The change made the Q feel much worse on high ping environments. Would often result in attacks you thought had canceled going through, and attacks you thought you hadn't canceled not going off. 2) Since the assassin update, Rengar's new ferocity system has gained a lot in terms of consistency. It's very easy to track your ferocity gains because "execute spell" = 1 ferocity point (the old Rengar had to hit abilities to get the points). Q being cancellable felt off in this new system as there would be numerous times where you THOUGHT you hit your Q (saw the animation, particle, and heard SFX) but you'd cancel it a tad early and not get the ferocity point, interrupting your entire combo's flow and your mental tracking of how much ferocity you have. If you see Q cast, you should get the point in most situations. As a side note to this, I'll be making it so Q's that are lost due to things like dodge and blind still grant ferocity in 8.6. Wasn't confident that I could make that change bug free for 8.5. Finally, there have been reports of live Q feeling "sticky" (like you can't cancel out of the winddown animation AFTER it hits), so I'll be investigating that to see if there's any feel gains to be had there for 8.6. No guarantees anything will come from that... Thanks for all the feedback friends. Rengar should hopefully a lot better in 8.5 w/ more changes to come in 8.6 (we'll be looking at numbers in that patch in case all the "buff fixes" for 8.5 don't get him in a good spot.)
do we have a chance to make the color of ultimate a little like the old one, only to see it with the wards, do you have any idea about this or that?
: #**LONG IN DEPTH pre-patch response to this. Always many thanks for the work.** --- #- Removal >-AP Rengar buffs are out. No more AP on boonetooth, no more AP ratio on R. We overall feel like AP Rengar, is a less healthy version of AD Rengar when allowed to be strong. They're trying to do the same thing (jump on you and burst you), but AP (when strong) does it faster and with less time to react. As mentioned before, we aren't going to be deliberately making AP Rengar worse than what's on live. Overall, the Q revert's Lich Bane synergy and some changes we're trying with the W are going to make AP Rengar better regardless. - This is good, AP build by far was too strong, and removing the AP on bonetooth, and removing the random AP ratios are good. Your wording is exactly correct here, nice overall direction. >-Triple Q, This pattern is bonkers. Especially in top lane. Likely going to make the empowered Q buff only last as long as the Ferocity combat timer (with a slight buffer added to make it feel good if you use it right at the end) and give the ferocity MS upfront on cast (if it isn't doing that already). Thoughts? - Triple Q isn't something I'd like to stay despite the 414k mastery points, it's not healthy or something that I'd want to stick. I really think it'll make top lane, or midlane scuttle crab based ganks really, oppressive. Any situation with this possible is stupid. - I don't know if lowering the Q buff will fix it, or if this is the correct direction. Someone else might have a better suggestion here. #- Numbers stuff >-Q AD ratio up. We felt that the Q output wasn't scaling sufficiently into late game after we nerfed the upfront damage on the ult, so experimenting with higer Q AD ratios since his damage is no longer as frontloaded. - I'm honestly not to sure about this. I've been playing Rengar, and he still feels quite strong already. Critgar will get stronger too, but I'll have to see so for myself if this Buff is appropriate. >-W base damage up, cooldown down. Feels like he's a bit low on AoE after the Q revert, so trying to help his early clear/laning a bit here. Also hopefully opens up more flexibility to max E second. Some worries about this making top-lane bruiser Rango too good. May need to revert. - If you're upping the base damage, and lowering the cooldown, it's another buff to AP Rengar. The old cooldown was 12 seconds flat, now it's 20 - 12, making it 18 - 12 or even 16 - 12, is fine. I don't know exact damage numbers, but I'd suggest 15 - 30 would be a good spot. - His clear isn't bad, you just have to kite. Without a leash I was able to clear around 3 minutes and 15 seconds, this clear was red -> raptors -> wolves -> blue -> gromp. You end up with around 60%+ hp, and can take scuttle to heal up. With a leash it's 3 minutes and 70%+ hp, and you can take scuttle to heal back up. Kiting camps is really important, if you're not kiting, or clearing well, his clear is bound to suffer. - This change may effect bruiser top lane Rengar more than you want to, but I still think bruiser Rengar needs a looking at if it's too strong, realistically in a game sense. Possibility of reverting this change? I'm not sure, need to test it, when it hits PBE. - POSSIBLE SUGGESTION Could make it so, if W hits a monster, the cooldown is lowered AND/OR, does 20% increased damage to monsters. #- Bug fixes >Doing a QA sweep and attempting to fix LOTS OF BUGS. - I'm sure someone else will have you covered with this, not something I can completely point out. #- Other stuff >-Still trying to figure out how to replicate the old Tiamat thing you guys seemed to enjoy so much. -Should he get more ferocity after ult? Should Q generate ferocity on cast? Answer is likely no. Uncertain. Still figuring it out. -Mecha Rengar Animation got some mixed feedback. Testing with VFX, may need to continue to iterate. -DOES ANYONE HAVE THE OLD BOONETOOTH ICONS IN A DRIVE SOMEWHERE? They looked pretty cool, kind of want to try hooking them up to see how they work, but I can't find them. They may have been lost to time...Will continue to search through the old files. Hrmmmm while typing this I thought of somewhere they might be... - So about the tiamat stuff, I've compiled and imgur album that should extremely help you out, I'm also linking you with info on the bonetooth stuff, also check out the reddit thread on rengar mains. Rengar 2/2 UPDATE submitted by zippymid. It should help you out as well with the bonetooth. It's where i got the links from, as well as the Rengar Mains discord. - About Mecha Rengar, I've added a bit of exploration for you in the same imgur album. - Let's talk his Q, and Fero gain on R. If you make Q give ferocity on cast, ask yourself, how does this work with leap, and other spells? I think we get a lot of weird situations tbh, I'm fine with ferocity gain on attack. Should remain a likely no. More ferocity after ult, okay let's go with some of his R theory. >Rengar R Theory - Can't give him too much damage on R, you remove free crit, and PBE rengar can now build crit, essentially is buffing his instant burst. - Can't give him more ferocity ON LEAP, you find interactions that are buggy as well as weaken his combo strength, it also directly goes against what you've done earlier to ferocity, the problem of instant snare, and instant big boi damage. - You can't give him too much shred either, you're literally making every other build stronger, when the main incentive should be go lethality, with crit being viable but not broken, and having bruiser when you need it. - Stats on KILL are much better than before kill, or before leaping onto a target. - To explain this, in my own view. Don't give him too much stuff once he's gone in through a leap. If you want to give him something after ult, make it just like bonetooth. Let's say Rengar activates R, if he kills his target within 3 seconds, then give him X ferocity amount. I like how he's rewarded for good positioning, with the bonus damage, armor shred, idk, I feel like conditional more armor shred might be better. It's just a theory afterall, not concrete. #- FAQ - I don't have anything to say on this, it's all correct. --- # Here are your links, and as always from all Rengar Players, thanks for your work. [Talking about Q and Tiamat, as well as Mecha Rengar](https://imgur.com/a/Tb7Oe) [Thread on Mecha Rengar with Slycreed comment](https://www.reddit.com/r/Rengarmains/comments/7u4rns/new_q_animation_for_mecha_rengar/) [Bonetooth Stuff Reddit Link, also check out ShadowAssault15's comment chain](https://www.reddit.com/r/Rengarmains/comments/7uy4a8/rengar_22_update/) [Old Rengar Base Skin Sounds](https://wiki.spectralcoding.com/info:lol_sound_pages:rengar_-_default) [Old Rengar Headhunter Sounds](https://wiki.spectralcoding.com/info:lol_sound_pages:rengar_-_headhunter_rengar)
i think q is godd now because rengar is an assassin man like zed his potential damage is very high and need to be
: If you're going to give Rengar full ferocity on leap then you might as well revert the whole ferocity system since the new one was designed so you couldn't have an empowered ability during leap, thus to remove root-from-stealth or massive damage from emp Q.
agree too this ferocity system is not healty for rengar
: Patch notes for 1/25 PBE build: > Q - > Grants 30% Attack Speed for Q attack >>> now grants 40% attack speed for next 2 attacks (Q + attack after) > No longer partial resets after the Q attack (Pressing Q is still a full reset) > > E - > Added a .6 AP ratio > > R - > Closest leap bonus: 100/175/250 (+.8 bonus AD, +.8 AP) physical damage >>> Rengar gains full ferocity at start of leap (he can cast empowered spell in the air) > > Sounds - > VO for gaining ferocity is back > VO for gaining bonetooth stacks is back > Q VO efforts are back > Third Thrill of the hunt VO is back (Uaghhg) > Full Ferocity SFX is back > Added new Q sound for cast and attack (both regular and empowered versions) > Heartbeat sounds on ult should be fixed (they were bugging out) **Context: ** I noticed that the partial reset I put on Q was causing Rengar to freakout during his combo and do some weird stuff, so I removed it and returned the old AS buff for 2 attacks. This hopefully makes Q feel even smoother AND gets rid of a ton of bugs that were popping up during combos. The bonus damage on the ult was making Rengar's initial undodgeable hit deal quite a bit of damage. We think its overall healthier if you can at least flash the bad things that are about to happen to you, so trying a different leap bonus (full ferocity). Hope is that this makes Rango less binary (he has empowered options if he jumps in and things don't go as planned) AND makes him less frustrating to play against as he isn't doing nearly as much damage in that first undodgeable instant. May also open up room to buff Q damage in the future. THIS CHANGE IS EXPERIMENTAL, WE MAY ITERATE AWAY FROM IT. E AP ratio accomplishes 2 things for AP Rango: 1) it compensates for the loss of the R AP ratio. 2) It makes a portion of his burst combo dodgeable. Hope is that this will make the build more maintainable going into the future. AP Rango bursts you with spells, AD Rango murders you with Q and basic attacks. Finally, Matteo, Rengar's sound designer, has been reading up on your feedback and decided it would be a good opportunity to get some choice VO lines back in where appropriate. Tell us what you think.
everthing is fine but this last patch i notice the new ulti change and this isn t good for rengar you should a combo to the enemies and slay them but new ulti leap ferocity system is not healty for rengar i think its change


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